Pub 108 - House Decay Rules Feedback

2456714

Comments

  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 66
    I think these changes are outstanding. Only paying accounts can punch the barrels... and the more paying subs the better. I like the part that it seems to be random, I hope the items go into the barrels randomly... so that nobody knows where items are located more or less. Some people have recorded the whole shard.

    In Fel, I am assuming hiding/stealth will still work. If so... I do not see why anyone has much of a problem. None of us were going to Fel IDOCs to fight before except like 2 or 3 guilds anyway (I was always hiding on my stealther if I went.) Those same guilds will still be fighting... punch and run. The Fel side will be more difficult to test, as we will have to see that in action on production shards to make any definitive stance.

    I think however... wrestling skill will not be involved.... simply punching unarmed. Thus, maybe you can kill the red (if it is a bot standing there spamming)... then take off your weapon and commence to punching. Either way, this is not so much different than before.

    The only thing I am curious about will be the limits of say, the barrel breaking (until it's empty I assume.... 50 items/100 stones at a time until all items removed?)..... the players punching (can they script 20 accounts to punch at once? / I am assuming recalling and emptying backpacks will be bothersome.... either way it is better than all 100 of the server birth / glacial items being gone in 10 seconds like before!).... and say house placement. I do not place houses and could care less, but I know some live for that type of stuff. I am assuming there will be a timer after all barrels are removed or until server up even, whichever happens first. That shouldn't change for anyone. Either way, just 1 fall time now should help everyone as well!

    Great changes Devs!!! Thank you!!!!!
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 66
    I think that people complaining on the topic that was closed are sorely mistaken. They were right in one thing, in that items should definitely go into our backpacks at random. I believe they will already, and that they know it will (which is why it was stated we have to have 50 items space open in our backpacks!)

    This is a win / win. Wait until you see the amount of real players going to IDOCs and having fun. Everybody is going to love this, and the blue players are already experienced from Krampus! Some new player might even get whole houses to themselves now, which will help the economy tremendously. This has the potential to bring prices down on everything, which is a good thing.

    Some people will likely be heading to castles with 70 accounts and auto punching (scripting).... no one has ever been able to stop such things from happening. GMs cannot be on to babysit 24 hours a day, but they will likely catch some! And at least someone is paying for 70 accounts again and it is not EJ accounts!!!! Be happy all, this is a major win for UO.

    Thank you Devs so much. We have a way for new players to catch up now! It's possible that many more of those 2-4 week players will stay now. Just please make items go into our backpacks and not on the ground! Ctrl-Shift doesn't work too well with 10,000 items on the ground. I already think you guys have items going into our backpacks directly... and am just stating this just in case. Thank you so much!!!
  • Most all houses on test shard are falling. there is a castle in the big area north of minoc falling soon the sign says an hour. many are there, yell in chat for a gate. 
  • VioletViolet Posts: 267
    Mordred said:
    but what happen with resources? 


    Any stackable items are deleted, including commodity deeds.Account bound items are also deleted as well as house only items (granite, grass tiles etc)
  • KyronixKyronix Posts: 766Dev
    As of this post the first house has fallen on TC1 and testing has commenced.
  • I was there. Pretty cool. Needs spawn, not enough death for my liking. I'm thinking something with magery while it is in the packing stage. That'll keep the players away from the fence before it can be attacked.
  • zzzzzz hitting for 10 with 120 wrest 120 anat 120 tact was boring.  needs monsters badly.  get rid of the barrels have the loot go on monsters. 
  • oh and this is easily scriptable. sure newer players have a bit of a chance but you arent solving any of the core problems with idocs. And you are ruining fel idocs.  
  • Kyronix said:
    As of this post the first house has fallen on TC1 and testing has commenced.

    I logged in and found a house in Malas that is falling in 12 minutes. I went to the trade minister in New Magincia Tram to see if it would be announced and it never did. Is it only announced at a certain phase? Or is it because it was a different facet?

    It appeared to announce a new IDOC every minute or so, but only announced it once and it didn't repeat. If this was on production and there was only one IDOC, would it repeat that one location or is it a one time announcement and done?

    I went back with about a minute to go and the live countdown was nice. I tried breaking the barrels with and without wrestling and didn't notice a difference. However, adding tactics and anatomy appeared to add some damage. I would "hit" for 2-9 damage. You CAN hold a spellbook, shield, or lantern and beat it down. I do think the time to knock down a barrel is too long. I didn't time it but it took a while. However, two people can beat on the same barrel to make it go faster.

    Now what is nice, you do NOT know what is in a barrel. After it is destroyed, items are randomly placed into your backpack! If you get something you don't want, drop it on the ground. If you like it, keep it obviously.

    So far, FANTASTIC CHANGE!
  • Maximus_NeximusMaximus_Neximus Posts: 237
    edited February 27
    I forgot to add, one negative is that anything that was in a bag no longer is. So you end up with a LOT of loose jewelry and empty containers. Ideally, items would stay inside of a container.

    This also includes books such as Alacrity books. I got one barrel with an empty book but several alacrity scrolls inside of it.
  • I'm very curious to see how this would play out in fel or Siege. The victor would be whoever has the most time I would think. I'm not sure it would work tbh. You start attacking a barrel... you die. They start attacking it, they die. It'll be interesting to see anyway. 
  • I'm very curious to see how this would play out in fel or Siege. The victor would be whoever has the most time I would think. I'm not sure it would work tbh. You start attacking a barrel... you die. They start attacking it, they die. It'll be interesting to see anyway. 

    If people take it seriously, I imagine it'll be like defending a champ. The open spot would be a chokepoint because it'd take too long to open a new one if you weren't there first.


  • Saw this come up on a house in fel. Not sure if it's a bug or for debugging purposes.
  • I love the new changes. I didn't noticed any difference with 1 wrestling and 120. This is awesome. Anyone can do them don't need to be fast or a fighter. Don't have to sit at idocs waiting on them to fall. Have no idea what you might get in your pack but it could be anything. I hit barrels with others and I got items so I guess we split the stuff. I think this makes idocs fair for everyone. Great job devs thanks so much. 
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 66
    edited February 27
    My initial impressions were that I liked it a ton. Need to do a bit more testing to let everyone know much more. Everyone there agreed in that this seems way more fair. I think the time it takes to destroy the barrels is fantastic, could even be longer I would imagine. The longer it takes, the greater the chance that some new player is going to get some tiny house all to themselves.

    Any less time time per barrel, I would be afraid people would just be recalling around and destroying barrels too quickly with a ton of accounts. They already have the runes marked and won't even bother with the town crier I am sure. The town crier is just to help us normal players.... thank you so much Devs. The timer displayed on the house sign is amazing... although I was unable to catch first hand if it just said 1 hour or any lesser time (2 minutes, ect...). Anyone there the moment it fell that saw?

    This helps out in so many ways Devs. For one... most scripters do so afk a lot. This is going to make it extremely difficult for them to leave toons parked at houses. Their bags are just going to fill up too fast and it won't be worth it for them. For two... it is random, they cannot target items. They will focus on the larger / well known museums now, but everyone else will be there too. Thank you guys so much.... I pray this goes live.
  • KHANKHAN Posts: 325
    @Kyronix I was at the castle IDOC. Here are my thoughts. I like the fact the loot is random. So no script looting all the good items. I thought the time frame to destroy the barrels was fine. I did get a lot of containers that were emply, but they might have just been placed that way on TC. I would be curious to know if that is the case, or if all containers drop in your backpack empty.

    My only "complaint" would be the auto deleting of all stackable items, although I I understand why it wouldn't be feasible to have 60,000 boards drop into your backpack.

    I also wonder if it would be possible to make EACH character help destroy one of the exterior emply barrels? That would keep someone from opening one "entry point" and then running 10-20 characters in at once. (I'm thinking about the fel aspect mainly).

    Overall, a really good effort! I plan to do more testing tomorrow.


    If you sell UO items for R.L. $$$, you need to quit playing UO , and get a BETTER R.L. JOB!
  • TimStTimSt Posts: 1,018

    The timer went to minutes then seconds. So once the countdown starts you get a pretty good idea of when it will fall.  No more having to camp at the house for 15 hours. 

  • TimStTimSt Posts: 1,018

    @Kyronix, Something that occurred to me after the castle test north of Minoc is that scripters will just use EJ characters as their pack animals.
    The script would go:

    1. Subscription character find barrel and attacks it
    2. Subscription character attacks barrel enough times to get the loot
    3. Subscription character transfers items from his backpack to EJ character
    4. Subscription character finds and attacks new barrel
    5. EJ character moves outside of the area
    6. EJ character unloads onto pack animal
    7. EJ character returns to Subscription character
    8. go to step 2

    To prevent this you would need to bar EJ characters from the area within the fence.

  • SkettSkett Posts: 343
    So this is the end game ? 
  • King_GregKing_Greg Posts: 164
    Would it be possible to just have the idoc attempt to put stackable items into deed form if they can be deeded, instead of just deleting them? 
  • IvenorIvenor Posts: 835
    King_Greg said:
    A  lot of talk about Fel idocs. 

    ITS FEL. Kill first, loot second. 

    +1000!!! :D
  • IvenorIvenor Posts: 835
    A question: why are
    • Account Bound Items
    • House Only Items
    deleted?

    In this way it is impossible to salvage from IDOC, e.g., SoulStones and Shard Shields!

    Frankly this don't seem too fair to me... :/

    I.

  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    Norry said:
    @ popps one EQ from a red, and you will be revealed. doesn't matter if you have 120 stealth and 100 hiding or not. they will reveal you with damage. almost no one uses detect hidden just to find someone in pvp. 

    they will use it for the passive chance, but there are so many other skills that can be useful for them to use instead.
    That's why Earthquake is overpowered.

    To have a simple skill which defeats an investment of 220 skill points (100.0 Hiding + 120.0 Stealth) is, to my viewing, R-I-D-I-C-O-L-O-U-S.

    And it should be addressed by the Developers.

    Ultima Online gameplay, to my opinion, should be way more dependant on skills as compared to items.

    Because, and we have seen it, itemization takes us nowhere.... only into an escalation of items which pregressively must be made more powerfull to maintain players interested but which then greatly enlargen the GAP in between new or returning players and older, existing players.

    Therefore, when a player INVESTS skill points in a Template, this investment of points should be much valued by gameplay mechanics, way more then a simple spell of properties on an item.

    At least, that is the way I see it.
  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    Radst said:
    1. FEL IDOC will also need adjusted
       - Seen those multiboxing auto archers?? and mage bots doing auto EQs??
       - and their ninja reveal is way OP. Together they reveal and kill everyone else easily and loot everything.
       - and they park their auto loot bots everywhere safely and ready to loot because no one else can get near to kill them.

    This insane level of greed and cheating will need to be addressed.

    You will hear many pvp'ers say FEL IDOC are the best...etc, but they wont mention who they cheat with in their guilds.

    FEL side is not so innocent.

    2. How about placing?
       - To remove script cheating completely is to just random raffle it.
       - Proposal:
          - Server will place the same exact building on spot when the barrel period is finished.
          - Anyone can click the house sign to join the raffle. One account per raffle.
          - After x hours, winner is drawn. Winner has x hours to accept trade.
          - and disallow those chop boxes on spot.

    FEL side is not so innocent.

    And to tell it all, I need to also mention GHOST CAMS.

    It is really astonishing that, to date, nothing really effective has been done to MAKE IT IMPOSSIBLE for players to use Ghost Cams to report players' activity in areas of the game.

    PvPers, to my point of view, should WORK to find their targets, spend their TIME to "actively" find them and not have them served to them on a silver platter because the game mechanics permit, one way or the other, they use of countless Ghost Cams.

    When a player kills another player and take this other players' belongings away, they are taking gameplay TIME away from their victim.

    Whatever time that victim invested in getting those items, they are getting deprived of it.

    Now, if gameplay mechanics permit this, AT THE VERY LEAST, likewise the victim had to spend their time into getting those items, the gameplay mechanics should also force, mandate, oblige the attackers to have to spend their time, actively, to search for their targets and not use convenient, BOT Ghost Cams which report a finding with a beep while they are watching TV or doing something else away from their keyboard....

    I frankly do not understand why, in a game old over 20 Years now, Ghost Cams have not been taken away for good from being possible to be exploited in PvP gameplay.
  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    Polaris said:
    I think these changes are outstanding. Only paying accounts can punch the barrels... and the more paying subs the better. I like the part that it seems to be random, I hope the items go into the barrels randomly... so that nobody knows where items are located more or less. Some people have recorded the whole shard.

    In Fel, I am assuming hiding/stealth will still work. If so... I do not see why anyone has much of a problem. None of us were going to Fel IDOCs to fight before except like 2 or 3 guilds anyway (I was always hiding on my stealther if I went.) Those same guilds will still be fighting... punch and run. The Fel side will be more difficult to test, as we will have to see that in action on production shards to make any definitive stance.

    I think however... wrestling skill will not be involved.... simply punching unarmed. Thus, maybe you can kill the red (if it is a bot standing there spamming)... then take off your weapon and commence to punching. Either way, this is not so much different than before.

    The only thing I am curious about will be the limits of say, the barrel breaking (until it's empty I assume.... 50 items/100 stones at a time until all items removed?)..... the players punching (can they script 20 accounts to punch at once? / I am assuming recalling and emptying backpacks will be bothersome.... either way it is better than all 100 of the server birth / glacial items being gone in 10 seconds like before!).... and say house placement. I do not place houses and could care less, but I know some live for that type of stuff. I am assuming there will be a timer after all barrels are removed or until server up even, whichever happens first. That shouldn't change for anyone. Either way, just 1 fall time now should help everyone as well!

    Great changes Devs!!! Thank you!!!!!
    I like the part that it seems to be random, I hope the items go into the barrels randomly... so that nobody knows where items are located more or less. Some people have recorded the whole shard.
    Absolutely this, RANDOMIZED packaging.....
    In Fel, I am assuming hiding/stealth will still work. If so... I do not see why anyone has much of a problem. 
    The need to "punch through the Barrel" might be a problem, depending on how the Developers will code the related mechanics....

    If the activity to punch through the Barrel will NOT reveal the hidden character, then players will be able to loot hidden a Felucca ruleset IDOC unless revealed, of course.

    Otherwise, if the activity of mandatorily having to punch through the barrel will reveal the hidden players, well, then I foresee lots of problems, especially for the weakest players who do not have the template skills nor high end gears to be competitive.

    Furthermore, to my viewing, the skill investment in 100.0 Hiding + 120.0 Stealth should never be easily defeated (reveal the hidden character) by a simple Earthquake spell....

  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    Polaris said:
    I think that people complaining on the topic that was closed are sorely mistaken. They were right in one thing, in that items should definitely go into our backpacks at random. I believe they will already, and that they know it will (which is why it was stated we have to have 50 items space open in our backpacks!)

    This is a win / win. Wait until you see the amount of real players going to IDOCs and having fun. Everybody is going to love this, and the blue players are already experienced from Krampus! Some new player might even get whole houses to themselves now, which will help the economy tremendously. This has the potential to bring prices down on everything, which is a good thing.

    Some people will likely be heading to castles with 70 accounts and auto punching (scripting).... no one has ever been able to stop such things from happening. GMs cannot be on to babysit 24 hours a day, but they will likely catch some! And at least someone is paying for 70 accounts again and it is not EJ accounts!!!! Be happy all, this is a major win for UO.

    Thank you Devs so much. We have a way for new players to catch up now! It's possible that many more of those 2-4 week players will stay now. Just please make items go into our backpacks and not on the ground! Ctrl-Shift doesn't work too well with 10,000 items on the ground. I already think you guys have items going into our backpacks directly... and am just stating this just in case. Thank you so much!!!
    Thank you Devs so much. We have a way for new players to catch up now! It's possible that many more of those 2-4 week players will stay now. 
    Well, that depends very much, to my viewing, on whether or not the new mechanics will give "room" to new and returning players who, obviously, are weaker and less geared up as compared to existing players, to ALSO be able to participate at IDOCS and get something from an IDOC.

    But if the related mechanics, and I am particularly talking about Felucca ruleset, will permit older players with more advanced characters and gear, to easily kill the new/returning weaker players and thus take them out from that IDOC, well, then this would not help these 2-4 weeks players to want to stay with Ultima Online and keep paying for their UO subscription....

    That is why I insist that an investment into Hiding and Stealth (be able to break through a barrel without being revealed by doing that) should be privileged over anything else, because such a mechanics could permit, to my viewing, these players who are weaker and not a match to older players, worse if organized and numerous, to still be able to grab a few things from an IDOC, yes, also a Felucca ruleset IDOC, and perhaps use those items and their worth to help them get started in the gameplay in Ultima Online.

    My thinking is, dear @Bleak , that the IDOCs gameplay mechanics should be addressed to distribute whatever wealth may come from an IDOC to those who MOST need it, that is the UO poor, and NOT to those old UO players who have multiples of already everything, several Castles and what not.

    If the goal is to INCREASE Ultima online players' base, then, to my humble opinion, IDOCs gameplay should be Designed in a way where the UO weakest and poorer players, YES, also in Felucca ruleset, will have a chance to at least get something from an IDOC and take it home or to their bank, if they are too poor to own a Home yet.

    So, please, make chances that would make sure to allow the weak and poor of UO STILL be able to get something from an IDOC, also in Felucca ruleset, and do not make it so that IDOCs wealth will always go towards those players most advanced, most geared up, most organized in numerous Guilds.

    Give to new and returning weaker players a chance to get something from IDOCs, be them Trammel or Felucca rulesets.

    Thanks.
  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    Violet said:
    Mordred said:
    but what happen with resources? 


    Any stackable items are deleted, including commodity deeds.Account bound items are also deleted as well as house only items (granite, grass tiles etc)
    Is this a BUG or intended ?

    If intended, this is NOT good and should be changed.

    Why not have stackable items be BROKEN UP into less heavy quantities which a character can carry ?

    This way, all those resources would be available to a higher number of players who could benefit from them.

    Deleting them seems to me such a waste.....

    Please, do not have them delete but makem them split up, automatically, in smaller quantities which character can carry.

    Thanks.
  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    Kyronix said:
    As of this post the first house has fallen on TC1 and testing has commenced.

    I logged in and found a house in Malas that is falling in 12 minutes. I went to the trade minister in New Magincia Tram to see if it would be announced and it never did. Is it only announced at a certain phase? Or is it because it was a different facet?

    It appeared to announce a new IDOC every minute or so, but only announced it once and it didn't repeat. If this was on production and there was only one IDOC, would it repeat that one location or is it a one time announcement and done?

    I went back with about a minute to go and the live countdown was nice. I tried breaking the barrels with and without wrestling and didn't notice a difference. However, adding tactics and anatomy appeared to add some damage. I would "hit" for 2-9 damage. You CAN hold a spellbook, shield, or lantern and beat it down. I do think the time to knock down a barrel is too long. I didn't time it but it took a while. However, two people can beat on the same barrel to make it go faster.

    Now what is nice, you do NOT know what is in a barrel. After it is destroyed, items are randomly placed into your backpack! If you get something you don't want, drop it on the ground. If you like it, keep it obviously.

    So far, FANTASTIC CHANGE!
    However, two people can beat on the same barrel to make it go faster.

    When 2 players hit the same barrel, what happens then to the content of the Barrel once it breaks open ?

    Was anyone able to test this out ?

    Do the barrel's content go all to the player who landed the final punch that broke the barrel ?

    Or do they go to BOTH players but, in such a case, how are the contents split up among them ?

    Evently ? Randomly ?

    I mean, say there were 2 items in the Barrel, and 1 was a 120 Resist scroll and the other a pair of shoes, and 1 character gets the shoes and the other the 120 resist scroll, would it be possible to consider this as a fair, even split even though they each got 1 item ?

  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    KHAN said:
    @ Kyronix I was at the castle IDOC. Here are my thoughts. I like the fact the loot is random. So no script looting all the good items. I thought the time frame to destroy the barrels was fine. I did get a lot of containers that were emply, but they might have just been placed that way on TC. I would be curious to know if that is the case, or if all containers drop in your backpack empty.

    My only "complaint" would be the auto deleting of all stackable items, although I I understand why it wouldn't be feasible to have 60,000 boards drop into your backpack.

    I also wonder if it would be possible to make EACH character help destroy one of the exterior emply barrels? That would keep someone from opening one "entry point" and then running 10-20 characters in at once. (I'm thinking about the fel aspect mainly).

    Overall, a really good effort! I plan to do more testing tomorrow.


    My only "complaint" would be the auto deleting of all stackable items, although I I understand why it wouldn't be feasible to have 60,000 boards drop into your backpack.

    I do not see why heavy stackables need to be auto deleted when they could, instead, be auto "SPLIT UP" into smaller quantities which characters could still carry....

    This way, a stack of 60,000 ingots, for example, rather then end up getting deleted, would remain in the game but, rather then go benefit 1 single player, would go to please a higher number of players....

    If any and all heavy stackables (likely resources) will get deleted at IDOCs, my big worry is that this taking out from the game of such a large amount of materials and resources will FURTHER hurt crafting which already is under life support in Ultima Online, because of the impossible competition with Legendary items drops that are so much better as craftable items.

    Why so ?

    Because taking out of the economy, althougether, all of these stackable resources and materials auto deleting them, would obviously get their prices to surge thus making Craftable items even more expensive to make as they might be now and thus, further less appealing as compared to Legendary drop items.

    So, please, rather then have stackable items auto delete because they are too heavy for 1 character to carry, make them auto split in smaller quantities which a character can carry so that more players will be able to benefit from getting them at an IDOC and all of these materials will still remain in the economy of the game thus helping to contain the pricing for Crafting and Imbuing materials.

    Thanks.
  • poppspopps Posts: 1,575
    edited February 27
    TimSt said:

    @ Kyronix, Something that occurred to me after the castle test north of Minoc is that scripters will just use EJ characters as their pack animals.
    The script would go:

    1. Subscription character find barrel and attacks it
    2. Subscription character attacks barrel enough times to get the loot
    3. Subscription character transfers items from his backpack to EJ character
    4. Subscription character finds and attacks new barrel
    5. EJ character moves outside of the area
    6. EJ character unloads onto pack animal
    7. EJ character returns to Subscription character
    8. go to step 2

    To prevent this you would need to bar EJ characters from the area within the fence.

    To prevent this you would need to bar EJ characters from the area within the fence.
    Not enough, because then the Subscription character would simply walk out the fenced area to transfer items to the EJ character and rinse and repeat.

    The fenced area needs to be VERY enlarged, to prevent this unloading onto EJ characters (or packies) to take too short a time, thus permitting to the subscribed character to get back to work another barrel in too short a time.

    If technically possible, a more permanent solution I think, could be to FLAG all items from an IDOC with a timer under which these IDOC items would simply, FLAT OUT, NOT be possible to be placed on either an EJ character or on a Pack animal of any kind. The existance of the timer still running on that item would send out an error message saying "sorry, this item cannot be transferred to this character or to this pack animal....".

    The subscribed character would actually need to recall to House, Bank or a Ship, unload it, and get back to the area for more barrel punching thus giving time to other players to get some items on their own.

    After that timer lapses then everything would go back to normal but until the timer is still on, the game would simply REFUSE for the item to get into an EJ backpack or into that of a pack animal.

    I think that this could be effectively address any scripting issue.

    Mind you, scripters could still do some scripting but at least, they would have to use multiple accounts Subscribed and thus PAID FOR which at least would bring more revenues to Ultima Online.

    Oh, and something which I have not seen as brought up as of yet..... how about making Bags of Sending NOT work also on IDOC items flagged by such a timer ?

    This would prevent the wealthy player with lots of Bags of Sending to ship fast items to the bank and thus beat a new or returning poor player who cannot afford them.

    What do you think about this, @Bleak ?

    Is it possible to see a timer be placed on all IDOCs items which would make them no placeable into EJ nd pack animals backpacks ?
Sign In or Register to comment.