Endless Journey, how about a new Fel beginning

Ikeelu

@Bilbo when you say real hardcore you mean the pay to win pvp? Because for $500 I can buy 840+ skill with max stats and mods suit and literally faceroll with a Nox, bush, mage. Not an ounce of skill required. Siege is annoying to play. But you know what? F2P shards cover this... oh ya, and have populations... weird. If official servers had a T2A/Pre-AoS Legacy shard they would have a new player base. Also if siege would have never seen AoS it’d be packed. Nobody cares to lose regs and gm weapons they just have fun bashing eachother to peices and the economy thrives off pvp. 

Game is broke but I still like it better than the other endless games I’ve played so oh well. 

Pawain

Mervyn said:

I thought of a 0 effort way to introduce a fel only shard.They could create a new shard with completely normal rules (except non transferable), make it so that you start in a fel city, and simply disable trammel on the moongate gump.

You wouldn't be able to do any trammel only content (so no doom artis, imbueing ingredients or slithers etc..), but if the shard was popular then they could start turning ter.mur and malas into fel etc..

Sounds great to me.  Then slowly put the fel only items in Tram on the other shards.

Win Win

Bilbo

Ikeelu said:

@ Bilbo when you say real hardcore you mean the pay to win pvp? Because for $500 I can buy 840+ skill with max stats and mods suit and literally faceroll with a Nox, bush, mage. Not an ounce of skill required. Siege is annoying to play. But you know what? F2P shards cover this... oh ya, and have populations... weird. If official servers had a T2A/Pre-AoS Legacy shard they would have a new player base. Also if siege would have never seen AoS it’d be packed. Nobody cares to lose regs and gm weapons they just have fun bashing eachother to peices and the economy thrives off pvp. 

Game is broke but I still like it better than the other endless games I’ve played so oh well. 

No I mean real PvP like is on SP where it aint all about the insured gear.

Cookie

Bilbo said:

No I mean real PvP like is on SP where it aint all about the insured gear.

I've personally really enjoyed playing SP, but I've stopped at the moment, I cannot get used to the ROT skillgain system.

I like to just play the game, but when I play, I like to see a skillgain every now and again, if I need to train skills, or especially if I've been deliberately trying to train it.

I just don't see that under ROT, I hate the fact, you have to log in for 1 minute, to get a skillgain, then that's it. it provides no incentive to actually play or train. Feels like the whole skillgain system is dead as part of your playstyle. It's got so slow for me, I've got bored of it, I'll be honest.

For me, its a shame, I love the shard itself, and everything it stands for, hope to be back when I can mentally manage it again. The craft skills are the ones that have really killed me, it just feels so wrong as a training/skillgain system, when you train a crafting skill, you do really expect to get a gain... Not just limited to 0.1 every god knows how long set period, I cannot stand to log in, get gain, log out. I want to play it, but to play it, knowing you won't get any gain, feels so pointless, especially when that's your main target, and all you really want.

I've found myself on Atlantic, which although is a completely scummy broken game, at least has a certain pace to it in terms of character progression when you just play.

I think my point is, the winning combination for a ton of players, would be Siege rulesets, with Production skillgain system. This is why there is often talk of a middle way/Felucca only shards.

Bilbo

@Cookie ; No they want a Fel only rule set with everything the prodo shards have, esp INS because they can't handle SP.  I would love UO to do this and give them all one way tickets then do away with the Fel rule set on all Prodo Shards, not the land just the rule set.  I can already hear the whining now, I wanna come back because it is so dead, LOL.

Ezekiel_Zane

Why don't they just add insurance to SP?  Add cursed items like prodo shards have.  You already can lose a lot of things even on prodo shards.  Things that can't be insured.  Why must they insist you lose everything including ALL your gear.  Add insurance or increase the Siege Blessing to more than one item.  Say, five or six items OR eight, covers a set of armor and jewls.

I'm just throwing that out there.  I scanned through most the thread.  Maybe somebody else already mentioned it and I missed it.

As far as insurance goes though, remember, everything on Siege costs more.  So if you ring up 4k-5k on prodo shards when you die.  You're gonna pay up 15k or so when you die on Siege.

Ikeelu

Siege is annoying to play... you need multiple accounts to function properly and most of what I have witnessed people do. Its fun to run around with the risk but the skill gain is off putting, waiting to find +25 bushifo jewels is off putting. Having to take a month to gm skill is off putting. The more I think of it a PvP shard wont help anything. PvP isn’t the issue at all, PK trolling is. 

Merus

In the beginning there was no such thing as insurance on any shard.  Gear was generic and easily replaceable.  Those days are long gone.

Personally I think the extreme itemization of gear lends weight to the idea of a PvP shard that includes insurance.  I would suggest something like 3x insurance cost or increase the bless count to 20.

Bilbo

SP players were asked about INS and they do not want it, WOW, UO listening to its players.

Lieutenant_Dan

For all of those people making statements like 'no one would play there'
There is absolutely no truth in this statement. 
You could say "oh I wouldn't play there".  But no,  you insist on misleading others to believe that your play style is the only one that they should allow.  It isn't!

But since we're stating opinions (and you all know what they say about opinions),  I'll give mine.
Since the dawn of Trammel,  UO has seen a huge decline in population.  Many of those departed players were avid PvPers,  Both red and blue alike. 
I would even be so bold as to say that the amount of PvPers that left UO would dwarf todays UO population.   Yes,  more pvpers have left the game than all of us put together. 
That's a huge player base that we no longer have and I haven't seen anything done by the dev team to regain that market that has actually worked.  VvV was a good effort but wasn't substantial enough to be truly effective.

I feel that what the OP has suggested would be effective at regaining these lost players and the added revenue would  justify the time and effort required by the developers.
Now aside from borrowing some of the Dev's valuable time,  adding a fel ruleset shard with insurance would not impact production shard players one bit.  For those that don't want to see the devs waste there time on it.  All i have to say is this...  You are a greedy greedy self centered bunch!

Tim

Before this thread gets shut down I just want to say again.

If you want a new shard you have to show how it would at least pay for it self let alone make a profit for Broadsword and EA. (Capitalism SUCKS) I don't see any change in UO that would or could compete with the modern "free" PVP games out there. Why play UO PVP and put up with a buggy interface relatively poor graphics and all the rest if you are not already invested in the game? So don't even bother with "Build it and they will come" unless you have some evidence to back it up. If I was looking for a PVP game it wouldn't be UO.

As for only costing some of the Dev's time are you forgetting about servers and bandwidth costs because the accountants at EA and Broadsword haven't ?

As I see it UO is a niche game that will no longer attract a large following without some massive changes. The first being a complete rewrite of the core program to kill all the bugs and bring the interface up to modern standers. In other words don't hold your breath.

That is not to say I think it is doomed. UO could live for many more years in the niche as long as they don't do anything stupid. Such as wast a lot of money just trying to be what they are not. UO was only full on PVP for a very small portion of their existence. Note I did not say it was the best of times or the worst of time just that it was short and a long time ago.

That being said if you want some suggestions on how to pay for it about I'll be happy to help. But be prepared most of my ideas end with put up $ or shut up.

Ikeelu

Call me ignorant but how do free shards operate? I have heard multiple people thst play free say they miss the stability of OSI. I realize the pre-aos days are dead but people left in mass due to aos and the item changes. I cant prove anybody would come back but if there was a legacy shard you’d have to choose between freeshards or OSI and I think people may pop in. Keep the same housing rules, no extra houses on legacy like siege. Get right back to pre-aos. Its just pvp (not pay to win) and the economy that theives off said pvp. PvM types supply power and vanq weps, smiths provide gm armor and weps, alchemists provide potions, you buy it cause you lose it. Sure it sucks losing a vanq, supremely accurate, indestructable katana, but risk and reward... Anybody can farm ogre lords for drops.. ANYBODY! 7xgm builds allow diversity and equality. Anybody, ANYBODY can 7xgm. No artifacts, no special drops, no powder of fortification. Items break and items drop. People play free shards to have this. Then they buy things with micro transactions I guess... The game is not what it was in 97, 03, or even 09. It is completely broken. I personally think removing pking would help prodo. I think pre-aos would bring back players. 

Mervyn

Ikeelu said:

I think pre-aos would bring back players. 

Pre-AOS was GARBAGE, I said it. People remember the game with rose tinted glasses because there were tons more players. But the game was terrible, the pvp was awful, para para explode fs para. 

UO lost most of its players to World of Warcraft, not because of AOS. 

Ikeelu

I cant remember when siege was released but had it stayed in a vacuum i think it would be packed. Even if it takes a month to gm a skill, you cant recall, and boats cost a ton. 

Ezekiel_Zane

For me, I think I noticed the biggest decline in players after ML and the stealth archer dominance.  I didn't quit UO but that's definitely when I gave up PvP.  Especially after healing speed was nerfed.

Ikeelu

Mervyn said:

Ikeelu said:

I think pre-aos would bring back players. 

Pre-AOS was GARBAGE, I said it. People remember the game with rose tinted glasses because there were tons more players. But the game was terrible, the pvp was awful, para para explode fs para. 

UO lost most of its players to World of Warcraft, not because of AOS. 

Then why are the longstanding free shards all T2A and Renaissance? 

Bilbo

Pre Age of Shit was NOT Garbage.  PvP was all about skill and for anybody to say PvP was worse couldn't PvP their way out of a wet paper bag.  Real PvP is only found on Sp and what people say is PvP in todays UO is nothing but EvE

Ikeelu

Bilbo said:

Pre Age of Shit was NOT Garbage.  PvP was all about skill and for anybody to say PvP was worse couldn't PvP their way out of a wet paper bag.  Real PvP is only found on Sp and what people say is PvP in todays UO is nothing but EvE

Gosh, I finally agree with Bilbo’s opinion 

Mervyn

I would say the biggest attraction to this shard would not be the fel only rule, but the non transfer rule. 

Garth_Grey

Ikeelu said:

Siege is annoying to play... you need multiple accounts to function properly and most of what I have witnessed people do. Its fun to run around with the risk but the skill gain is off putting, waiting to find +25 bushifo jewels is off putting. Having to take a month to gm skill is off putting. The more I think of it a PvP shard wont help anything. PvP isn’t the issue at all, PK trolling is. 

I don't think you ever logged on to Siege at all, because you clearly have no clue at all what you're talking about.

Ikeelu

@Garth_Grey If you don’t have a soul stone or a second account please keep talking. Otherwise please enlighten me? I have a house, I’ve collected a LRC suit. I play when im completely fed up on prodo but still havent GM’ed a skill. I see no PvP, I read the chat but nothing too interesting. Maybe I just buy a mythic token on the “hard shard” to get a head start. 

Garth_Grey

You won't be the first person to ever buy a mythic token on Siege. I've bought several myself, and once you learn how to do it, you can  GM and 120 any skill in the game in faster time than you think.

Summoned

What we need, and I know it's been said is a pre AOS shard and I know they said they don't have a copy... Like I believe that... They could simply make a ring that has all the stats on it... Make it blessed, everyone has it and you can play naked on foot like the days of old. That would end the game of needing the best of the best gear to play and make the game playable again. 

Maddog

Why not just relaunch the Second age version with the original patch's de bugged, and see who comes out to play,  Everything be pre Trammel rule sets and stats. 

crunchnasty

Bilbo said:

Pre Age of Shit was NOT Garbage.  PvP was all about skill and for anybody to say PvP was worse couldn't PvP their way out of a wet paper bag.  Real PvP is only found on Sp and what people say is PvP in todays UO is nothing but EvE

WOW Bilbo has my vote on this one

Mervyn

This vision is now being realised. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7thyJjHhE6U

Cookie

Mervyn said:

This vision is now being realised. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7thyJjHhE6U

Except they are shying away from the Felucca, PvP aspect due to a minority of very loud pvm Trammel players.

How this misinformation happened in the first place, and has been allowed to enbed like it has, is beyond me. Other games are all about the pvp, and the integration of a balanced game, and they are working fine, it's just a vocal minority in UO that have pulled off completely diluting this game.

All the people watching and dying to come back are asking;

"What about the pvp?"

And no-one is answering that question.

Cookie

Lieutenant_Dan said:

For all of those people making statements like 'no one would play there'
There is absolutely no truth in this statement. 
You could say "oh I wouldn't play there".  But no,  you insist on misleading others to believe that your play style is the only one that they should allow.  It isn't!

But since we're stating opinions (and you all know what they say about opinions),  I'll give mine.
Since the dawn of Trammel,  UO has seen a huge decline in population.  Many of those departed players were avid PvPers,  Both red and blue alike. 
I would even be so bold as to say that the amount of PvPers that left UO would dwarf todays UO population.   Yes,  more pvpers have left the game than all of us put together. 
That's a huge player base that we no longer have and I haven't seen anything done by the dev team to regain that market that has actually worked.  VvV was a good effort but wasn't substantial enough to be truly effective.

I feel that what the OP has suggested would be effective at regaining these lost players and the added revenue would  justify the time and effort required by the developers.
Now aside from borrowing some of the Dev's valuable time,  adding a fel ruleset shard with insurance would not impact production shard players one bit.  For those that don't want to see the devs waste there time on it.  All i have to say is this...  You are a greedy greedy self centered bunch!

To me, this is one of the best quotes and posts in this topic.

popps

Cookie said:

Mervyn said:

This vision is now being realised. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7thyJjHhE6U

Except they are shying away from the Felucca, PvP aspect due to a minority of very loud pvm Trammel players.

How this misinformation happened in the first place, and has been allowed to enbed like it has, is beyond me. Other games are all about the pvp, and the integration of a balanced game, and they are working fine, it's just a vocal minority in UO that have pulled off completely diluting this game.

All the people watching and dying to come back are asking;

"What about the pvp?"

And no-one is answering that question.

The dfference is, that other games have been quite succesfully in dealing with PvP cheating.... 

Some use the VAC (Valve Anti-Cheat ), some others use other ways to detect and then ban cheaters.

Some game Companies have banned even millions of players for cheating in their games....

https://www.thegamer.com/pubg-mobile-bans-2-2-million-accounts-hacking/

Or many tens of thousands... https://www.firstpost.com/tech/news-analysis/blizzard-closes-76000-wow-accounts-3549451.html

In Ultima Online, because it is old code possibly, it has always been hard to succeed in stopping players from cheating. Over the Years a lot of Developers Teams have been trying hard to get rid of cheating in Ultima Online but, unfortunately, it keeps going on and being quite rampant as one can tell from many Forum posts or by seeing it in the game.

Unfortunately, many players believe that playing competitive PvP in games where cheating is possible, is not worth their time.

Why bother with trying to play a competitive PvP if there is a good chance that an opponent might be using Cheats, hacks or scripts to get an edge when they do not want to play with any cheating involved ?

So, these players simply do not bother.

At least, that is how I see it.

Mervyn

In South Korea, they fill stadiums of fans to watch people play certain games, do you think they’ll fill stadiums watching Sampires spam AI on every single monster, throwing in an occasional whirlwind when more mobs appear?