New Tmap proposals

MissEMissE Posts: 384
edited May 16 in Test Center
Seems they are totally destroying the fun on high level tmaps by putting in a part when you have to do a stupid puzzleboard to disarm traps etc.   Here's to destroyed loot, a bunch of ppl standing around fiddling with their pink bits while waiting for the thunter to work their way through a puzzle, or just adding a whole lot of boring puzzle decoding  to just make tmapping another grind fest if you prefer to do them solo. 

You can't comment with feedback on this on this forum as if you don't put it in some kinda 'required' format it gets deleted so suggest you treasure hunters go read what people are saying on the 'other' forum and then come back to the test center forum here and try and navigate exactly how you are supposed to give your feedback so it doesn't get deleted.

Sadly I am unable to get on test centre to actually 'test' it but from reading everyone else's feedback on the forum that you can actually have your say on, it is NOT good.

EDIT: and just for the record I HATE puzzleboards, seriously HATE them. They are a drag and just a total time waster, they add absolutely bugger all to your intellectual skills and are the most absolutely  MOST BORING activity in UO. 

Sure they are fine on stuff you do once a year but on T-Mapping that a lot of people do every day generally multiple times a day or every week and have done for years this is just a nail in the coffin if it remains.  

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Comments

  • Max_BlackoakMax_Blackoak Posts: 316
    I have to agree about the puzzles. I am torn a bit though because I thought adding powerscrolls to tmaps was a big mistake, however now with it only being 105s and 110s and the puzzles on top I can probably live with that lol
  • MakasouleaterMakasouleater Posts: 10
    edited May 16
    I agree they just killed t maps for me bastards. It was like one of my favorites, now I gotta have remove trap, and solve a stupid puzzle. Lost my sub if they do this. They should follow the old saying if it ain't broke don't fix it. Treasure hunting wasn't broke. They should of spent more time on the boat content than messing with treasure hunting. All they did was make it more simple, they could of added player made boats, and all sorts of stuff. Nope retard puzzle traps are what these special people came up with.
  • jaytinjaytin Posts: 407
    @MissE +1 I agree with you 100%
  • JollyJadeJollyJade Posts: 320
    edited May 16
    RIP tmaps. @Kyronix does not want to hear it, just looking for people to do free QA for him and at least one cheerleader telling its fun.
  • Uriah_HeepUriah_Heep Posts: 492
    I was one of them hollerin for a lot upgrade.
    But none of us, I think, ever envisioned the nightmare to come.  From a simple request to a total overhaul, completely changing the face of t-hunting forever.

    RIP treasure hunting, You are another one of the things that made UO great that is having the fun designed out of it. 
  • jaytinjaytin Posts: 407
    Some of us didn't even ask for a loot upgrade, we just accepted that the loot was bad but we enjoyed them anyway, I learned long ago in UO to be careful what you wish for. I wonder how many of the people who think the changes are great actually play a dedicated t-hunter template daily/weekly?
  • Uriah_HeepUriah_Heep Posts: 492
    I just don't think they ever stop and reason it out.

    You know, if we wanted to play a different game, we would.  So stop making UO a different game

  • MakasouleaterMakasouleater Posts: 10
    Everything should be considered a work-in-progress and subject to change and/or removal.  

    Well they did say that so there is a tiny bit of hope. I doubt they are gonna listen though and delete all the changes. 
  • JollyJadeJollyJade Posts: 320
    "Everything"  :D You just have to believe...
  • dvviddvvid Posts: 36
    The puzzle stuff is definitely going to be annoying. 
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,764
    edited May 16
    MissE said:
    Sadly I am unable to get on test centre to actually 'test' it but from reading everyone else's feedback on the forum that you can actually have your say on, it is NOT good.  

    Maybe just wait until character copy is working again before you freak out?
    i’m sure it will be up again soon.

    As for being able to have a say on Stratics. I can assure you there is less freedom of expression there than here. They just only allow opinions the same as yours. So you’ll never have a post removed there. You’ll be very content there in your echo chamber. 
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • MakasouleaterMakasouleater Posts: 10
    dvvid said:
    The puzzle stuff is definitely going to be annoying. 
    Not only that being forced to have more skills. A useless 110 power scroll doesnt make up for that lol.
  • jelinidasjelinidas Posts: 45
    +1 MissE. Who the heck does treasure maps as a group anyways? The last time, and only time, I did was on a Friday Night Hunt so some tamers could get some new pets. Where in the heck did these ideas come from?? From a loot bump to total revamp. And a horrible revamp at that! Puzzles have no business at all in treasure hunting. Another grind fest for sure. 

    Puck Fuzzles!  Leave treasure hunting alone. Forget we asked!
  • DrakelordDrakelord Posts: 664
    I still do not understand the reasons for renaming the maps, I am so used to the old names and now I have to relearn all of them again, I hope uo.guide puts a update out when this goes live so I can have a page to look at.

    Did they fix the chest falling apart yet on TC?  I have not been back since my last posting on that
    Remove Trap = Bad News
    for
    Treasure Hunters
  • jaytinjaytin Posts: 407
    I find the new names very convoluted and confusing, just when I had remembered what level the old names were.  :/
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,764
    edited May 16
    I thought they reduced the number of map levels from 7 to 5?
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • KyronixKyronix Posts: 494Dev
    edited May 16
    I would encourage everyone who hasn't yet to do a couple things, because I'm seeing a lot of misinformation being spread, and a lot of speculation that isn't based on what is actually on TC1.

    To address the feedback thread - you can share you opinion, negative or otherwise, however we are asking that you add some context so we can appreciate where you are coming from.  

    "This sucks don't do it."
    "All we asked for was a loot upgrade"
    "They don't want to hear it all they do is want free QA"
    "Do they ever stop and reason this out?"

    These posts are not helpful.  They do not illustrate constructive feedback, nor do they contribute to the iterative process of building the feature.  That is why we have a strict format in the main feedback thread.

    Here are a couple of key points to keep in mind, that I have mentioned on several occasions.  

    If you do not like puzzles or you want to do T-maps solo - target Lvl 3 maps.  There is no puzzle trap.  You do not *need* remove trap, or lockpicking for that matter.  You can use magic unlock and magic trap - provided your magery is high enough.  The base loot tables are exactly the same for Lvl 3 as they are for Lvl 4 and Lvl 5.

    With regard to destroying items upon failure - lockpicking failures work exactly the same as they do on production right now.  Remove Trap failures have a small chance (that gets even smaller with higher Remove Trap skill investment) to destroy an item.  

    Again - I encourage everyone to hop on TC1 and experience the changes first hand and use the feedback to give your thoughtful, reasoned, and constructive feedback.

    See you on TC1!



  • FaerylFaeryl Posts: 240
    Drakelord said:
    I still do not understand the reasons for renaming the maps, I am so used to the old names and now I have to relearn all of them again, I hope uo.guide puts a update out when this goes live so I can have a page to look at.

    Did they fix the chest falling apart yet on TC?  I have not been back since my last posting on that
    Per Kyronix on the currently closed discussion thread:

    "PSA: If you have chests that give you the message "The treasure chest fell apart for some reason..." it is likely a Ranger chest. Throw it away and get some new ones. With the removal of the barbarian chests, these pre-release 2 maps will no longer work. "
  • jelinidasjelinidas Posts: 45
    Kyronix said:


    Here are a couple of key points to keep in mind, that I have mentioned on several occasions.  

    If you do not like puzzles or you want to do T-maps solo - target Lvl 3 maps.  There is no puzzle trap.  You do not *need* remove trap, or lockpicking for that matter.  You can use magic unlock and magic trap - provided your magery is high enough.  The loot tables are exactly the same for Lvl 3 as they are for Lvl 4 and Lvl 5.


    Perhaps its not really only the loot that's in question, but the fight as well. Will the guardians be the same in the new lvl3 maps as they are in the new lvl4 and 5s? 

    We have a steady supply now of current lvl6 maps with miasma. Current lvl6 maps are a decent challenge now for solo hunters. It sounds like these new lvl3 maps are not really what solo players are used to. Honestly they sound boring if I am reading right. Cast a EV, hide, loot. *yawn*  

    Where can we get these new lvl3? 

    As far as going to TC1, I tried. Its down for char copy more then its up. Honestly, I gave up.

    Puzzles are not fun for ME. From what I am reading, I am far from alone. I hope you rethink this. All I wanted was a loot bump, and less items, junk. From what I am reading, I am far from alone.
    Dropping mining and adding remove trap was doable, but I draw the line at puzzles. In my opinion they have no place in UO treasure hunting. There are tons of other places in UO that already have them. From what I am reading, I am far from alone.

    In MY opinion, scrap the whole update. Forget we asked. I understand you have time and effort in it, but this is not good and surly not going to be well received. You are going to do more harm then good. And, you guessed it, from what I am reading, I am far from alone.
  • FaerylFaeryl Posts: 240
    Personally, I quite enjoy the puzzles. It adds a bit more depth and interaction to treasure hunting, instead of the old unlock and boom.

    I haven't actually done a hoard or trove chest yet, but if they're identical in size to training kits and there's a chance at any of the three types... well, I don't think I'll find it too hard. Especially with all the practice I'll get training RT beforehand.
  • JollyJadeJollyJade Posts: 320
    edited May 16
    Kyronix said:

    "This sucks don't do it."
    "All we asked for was a loot upgrade"
    "They don't want to hear it all they do is want free QA"
    "Do they ever stop and reason this out?"

    These posts are not helpful.
    But they are what YOUR PLAYERS honestly think about it...

    I can tell you I don't like it all day long. You won't reconsider adding new skills or those traps. "They don't want to hear it all they do is want free QA" is spot on, sorry.

    Its just not worth the time spelling it out over and over again, you won't accept it. Just more frustration for those keeping some hopes up.

    If you can't see the point of all the feedback here then idk... "not helpful" .. in respect to doing the free QA lol..
  • MerusMerus Posts: 104
    Kyronix said:
    I would encourage everyone who hasn't yet to do a couple things, because I'm seeing a lot of misinformation being spread, and a lot of speculation that isn't based on what is actually on TC1.

    To address the feedback thread - you can share you opinion, negative or otherwise, however we are asking that you add some context so we can appreciate where you are coming from.  

    "This sucks don't do it."
    "All we asked for was a loot upgrade"
    "They don't want to hear it all they do is want free QA"
    "Do they ever stop and reason this out?"

    These posts are not helpful.  They do not illustrate constructive feedback, nor do they contribute to the iterative process of building the feature.  That is why we have a strict format in the main feedback thread.

    Here are a couple of key points to keep in mind, that I have mentioned on several occasions.  

    If you do not like puzzles or you want to do T-maps solo - target Lvl 3 maps.  There is no puzzle trap.  You do not *need* remove trap, or lockpicking for that matter.  You can use magic unlock and magic trap - provided your magery is high enough.  The base loot tables are exactly the same for Lvl 3 as they are for Lvl 4 and Lvl 5.

    With regard to destroying items upon failure - lockpicking failures work exactly the same as they do on production right now.  Remove Trap failures have a small chance (that gets even smaller with higher Remove Trap skill investment) to destroy an item.  

    Again - I encourage everyone to hop on TC1 and experience the changes first hand and use the feedback to give your thoughtful, reasoned, and constructive feedback.

    See you on TC1!



    @Kyronix The “base loot” comment is a cop out.  The loot in level 4 and 5 maps must have better loot or there would be no point in having them exist.

    Players have been, and continue to tell you that we want access to the best loot that treasure maps have to offer without the addition of requiring remove trap to get it.  My fear, along with many others is that you (the developers) have your mind made up about including remove trap and absolutely no amount of feedback, constructive or otherwise, is going to change that.  If you ask for players feedback, honestly, you should listen to it.  No one is going to stop doing maps or close an account because you leave remove trap out of this revamp... but adding it will have that negative impact.
  • MariahMariah Posts: 642Moderator
    Drakelord said:
     I hope uo.guide puts a update out when this goes live so I can have a page to look at.
    I will be updating the wiki page when I have more concrete information on what to update it to. In fact I have begun the process working on a copy of the page offline, updating the information that we already know.
  • KyronixKyronix Posts: 494Dev
    edited May 16
    Merus said:

    @ Kyronix The “base loot” comment is a cop out.  The loot in level 4 and 5 maps must have better loot or there would be no point in having them exist.

    Players have been, and continue to tell you that we want access to the best loot that treasure maps have to offer without the addition of requiring remove trap to get it.  My fear, along with many others is that you (the developers) have your mind made up about including remove trap and absolutely no amount of feedback, constructive or otherwise, is going to change that.  If you ask for players feedback, honestly, you should listen to it.  No one is going to stop doing maps or close an account because you leave remove trap out of this revamp... but adding it will have that negative impact.
    It's not a cop out, its how the levels are currently implemented.  The only difference comes in the quantity, and the chance to get some items that are in the loot table.  This chance, however, is negated (in a pretty big way) by the guaranteed number of items that we are putting in a chest that was implemented in the latest release.  The bottom line is there isn't anything in a Lvl 4 or 5 that you can't get in a Lvl 3.  

    As for the mobs - they are definitely more difficult at Lvl 4 and 5 in a base situation, however Lvl 3 does have a chance to get higher end mobs thrown in during the spawn.  

    "Players have been, and continue to tell you that we want access to the best loot that treasure maps have to offer without the addition of requiring remove trap to get it. "

    This is an untenable situation.  You cannot have it both ways.  Traps have always been part of Treasure Hunting, and have always been a broken part of treasure hunting.  If you want access to the absolute best loot that the encounter has to offer you will have to choose whether you want to invest skill in Remove Trap (or Magery) OR if you don't you will have to be solve the puzzle trap and take your chances.  We're definitely open to feedback, and alternatives to the current implementation.  If I wasn't I wouldn't expend the effort required to track and respond to all of it across all the lines of communication.  
  • jelinidasjelinidas Posts: 45
    Kyronix said:


    As for the mobs - they are definitely more difficult at Lvl 4 and 5 in a base situation, however Lvl 3 does have a chance to get higher end mobs thrown in during the spawn.  

    This is what I was talking about. Lvl 3 maps are going to be boring for seasoned treasure hunters who play SOLO. Who asked for this?? What happened to the PLAYER ideas from before you spent hours and hours coding this flop? 

    Here is a question for you...Start a poll, who goes treasure as a group? I cant think of much that sounds more boring then watching one guy work a puzzle. smh
  • FaerylFaeryl Posts: 240
    jelinidas said:
    Kyronix said:


    As for the mobs - they are definitely more difficult at Lvl 4 and 5 in a base situation, however Lvl 3 does have a chance to get higher end mobs thrown in during the spawn.  

    This is what I was talking about. Lvl 3 maps are going to be boring for seasoned treasure hunters who play SOLO. Who asked for this?? What happened to the PLAYER ideas from before you spent hours and hours coding this flop? 

    Here is a question for you...Start a poll, who goes treasure as a group? I cant think of much that sounds more boring then watching one guy work a puzzle. smh
    My guild occasionally does a treasure map or two during our RP events. As a group. Also, if any of my guildmates happen to be bored while I'm out, I'll let them tag along. Some have even tagged along to help me out on a map I might have trouble with. (Curse those renegade changelings!)

    In short, I have no problem taking a group treasure hunting, and they always seem to enjoy it. Hell, it was even suggested that we should try fit treasure hunting into our events more frequently.
  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 510
    I've not had chance to do much yet since the last update. So far my thoughts are:
    Stash - cache maps I'm more or less happy with, and the intent to make the lower end maps more worth doing has, I think, succeeded. I will do them for the sots an soas they might contain.

    Artisan cache though I'm not so sure on.  Hammers and axes may be appropriate, but I don't know an artisan that wants them unless they're in some way related to crafting such as gargoyle pickaxes, runic hammers etc.  Possibly stay with the 'resources' theme and increasing quantities, or increasing stacks.  Stash have 1 x 50 stack, supply have 1 x 100 stack. Maybe cache could have 1 x 150? or 2 x 75? or something?  

    I'm happy to add remove trap to my template, and have on test, simply swapping out mining. But I'm not at all keen on the puzzles. 
  • KyronixKyronix Posts: 494Dev
    jelinidas said:
    Kyronix said:


    As for the mobs - they are definitely more difficult at Lvl 4 and 5 in a base situation, however Lvl 3 does have a chance to get higher end mobs thrown in during the spawn.  

    This is what I was talking about. Lvl 3 maps are going to be boring for seasoned treasure hunters who play SOLO. Who asked for this?? What happened to the PLAYER ideas from before you spent hours and hours coding this flop? 

    Here is a question for you...Start a poll, who goes treasure as a group? I cant think of much that sounds more boring then watching one guy work a puzzle. smh
    This was based on the initial discussion threads - MOST players could easily solo a Lvl 3.  Some could solo a 4 or 5.  Few could solo a 6 or 7.

    With the new distribution for maps the way they are perhaps we may restrict the puzzle trap to a Lvl 5 only, and extend the explosion to a Lvl 4. Remains to be seen.

    There has to be a give and take though - traps (in whatever final form they take) are a part of treasure hunting.  There's a few variables we have to work with - puzzles, explosions, Remove Trap Skill, Magic Untrap.  How they all shuffle into the final encounter remains to be seen.
  • jaytinjaytin Posts: 407
    The only time I ever saw people group up for t-hunts was to get those new drakes, nobody makes a group to t-hunt, it would be really boring for most of the group. Multi-clienting is not a group and I don't even consider that actually being a t-hunter.
  • JollyJadeJollyJade Posts: 320
    edited May 16
    I tried to do T-Hunting with other people. But apart from taking some noob once in a blue moon, as soon as we were two expirienced hunters we were just standing in each others way.

    People who can't solo the old 6 maps just didn't build a T-Hunter. Those will be happy.

    People who had a T-Hunter and solo'd the 6 and 7 maps will call it quits over this nonsense.

    Maybe the RPers will keep the profession up, but what does it matter anyway.. its just sad.. probably not the feedback anyone is looking for..
This discussion has been closed.