Upcoming combat changes in Publish 103

BleakBleak Posts: 87Dev
edited October 2018 in Test Center

The following combat changes are slated for release in Publish 103. We wanted to give everyone interested a time to provide feedback, so head on over to TC1 and check them out!

•         The Parry formula dexterity modifier has increased from 80 to 95 in player vs player. 

•         Discordance Rework (PvP Only). There is no change in how Discordance works versus non-players.

·         Bards can now use Discordance on player targets. This rework only allows Bards to remove all item skill bonuses from a target player.

·         Discordance will last up to 5 seconds or 8 seconds if the Bard is Focused Spec on players.

·         A Bard can only discord one player target at a time.

·         Discord will also be removed when:

  1. The target is dead.
  2. The bard is dead.
  3. The target is out of range.
  4. The target is hidden.
  5. The bard is hidden.

•         Magic fish pies no longer soak player vs player damage.

•         The weapon hit property splintering no longer triggers on special moves.


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Comments

  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,113
    edited October 2018
    Okay you need 95 now to parry, please tell me this is NOT just for pvp and is for pvm too.. cos that will WAY over complicate things and will make it even harder for people to do both PvP and PvM on the same suit.

    Also, is there any sort of notification in game that you require 95 dex? Like... can you make the shields have a dex requirement of 95 or provide a system message to say “you failed to parry as your dexterity was too low” or ANYTHING to notify players of the game mechanics in game.

    everything else is all good 
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • I agree with @Mervyn that the parry change should also be for PVM and PVP, no reason for it not to be. Also the dex notification should be something mentioned within the game as well. I would make this part of this publish because well, now is the time to do it.

     And awesome that disco can be used in pvp. Wish it did more than negate skill bonuses but awesome regardless.
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,113
    edited October 2018
    Having a different requirement for pvm vs pvp will just make the game even more elitist. Champ spawners already complain that they get killed so easily by PvPers, this would just make it even easier to kill PvMers as they would have 80 dex to deal with spawn then they would not be able to parry a PvPers attack. 

    Please make it harder for me to kill blue spawners, not easier. I do not require any more advantages.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,113
    edited October 2018
    Can pets discord players in this new way?
    I would say it’s probably okay to allow pets to discord a player in this new way. But maybe with not as strong effect as a player discording. 
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • SlappyjipperSlappyjipper Posts: 8
    edited October 2018
    Fish pies and splinter change is good. Agree with above for parry. Discordance addition is pointless. Nobody will want to sacrifice 240 skill points (120 music/discord) on their own template to lower 60 - 100 item skill points on the occasional enemy. Nobody will use this as it is and any other change to it will likely make it too overpowered. Scrap the discordance idea and use that time on something different :) Pvp doesn't need these kind of combat changes or additions. We need some new things to fight over!
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,113
    you say discord will be pointless, some people bring a discorder to Champ bosses etc, at least now they won't be so passive. It may be relatively pointless but it's not a negative change.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • Good fixes for splinter and pies.  Discord thing isn't going to be used like that, if anything just have discord In pvp work where it lowers all target resists by 15, similar to corpseskin but all resists.  Personally that parry change isn't gonna change anything, there has to be some negative to parry and casting schools.  Adding 15 dex with todays gear plus ridic lmc bonus of 55 everyone will just slightly adjust mana for dex and same few templates will be played.  I would suggest they put something like if magery is over 30 then evasion timer is cut in half and max parry chance is only 20%.  Also to go along with the splinter change, poisoning needs to be slightly easier to cure and just add a small cooldown to cure potions.   Now as far as skill point bonus goes, either just cap it or encourage use of real skill points by adding negatives to using skill bonus.  What I mean is for every 30 skill point bonus you lose 5 sdi. 5ssi, depending on the skill bonus.  That would help balance it out and make it pvp only restrictions so that pvm doesn't get upset.
  • CetricCetric Posts: 49
    personally think splinter no longer proccing on any special will absolutely kill whats left of the traditional dexer.  a 1 tile dexer NEEDS splinter to proc on specials to kill anyone.

    discord thing is really weird....

    Not sure why ud try to hurt parry mages when evasion is what needs toned down.


    If splinter doesn't proc on any special moves, will it also not proc with focus attack, deathstrike, lightning strike, masteries, etc?
  • CazadorCazador Posts: 23
    Scrap the discord idea pls!

    use ItemID - 2.25 Cast of ItemDisabling
    (lasts 8 seconds)

    change splinter to not proc on specials if magery > 70. And cost 10mana on base attacks. 

    Idc about pies do whatever.

    parry fix 100 real dex or 125 potted

    fix evasion.
    No evasion if magery over 70
  • TailTail Posts: 8
    edited October 2018
    Clearly the bigger problem with this parry change is...it won't change a thing. Unless you require us to have 125 Dex to parry, (and the effects would be small due to our chars running 115 dex with 180 mana at end game) this method isn't a good fix. I will propose an idea to make parry 'NOT GREAT AGAIN'.

    #1 Change the Parry formula to give less chance to parry based on certain conditions like: {Pseudo Code]
    •      if (player hasParried in the last 10 seconds) {players parry % chance is equal to 10% for 10 seconds.}
    Anyways, this could be one way you could do it. just my 2 cents.
  • So parry is still overpowered we just made it cost a little more of your stats okay seems fair and screwed dexxers more hard enough to kill all these parry toons lets screw over splinter seems fair lol good lazy fix guys make mages even more powerful how about making splintering not work so well for mages? idk dont take it out on dexxxers and really fix parry dont just make it cost more stats
  • The_Higgs_1The_Higgs_1 Posts: 201
    edited October 2018
    Also be sure to add ninjitsu focus attack and lightning strike to list of things that cant be used with splintering.  
    I would also recommend that splintering should have a ten sec immunity on target, so that someone cant just spam splintering over and over again.  Can you guys also consider removing the lmc bonuses back to 40 cap regardless of armor type?!  With todays gear there is no need to have such bonuses anymore.  Items are way too strong to keep such a thing.
  • TailTail Posts: 8
    I couldn't agree more . I think when u get splintered you should have a at least 3 seconds before you can be splintered again.
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,113
    edited October 2018
    You lot are jokers

    they introduced tactics as a requirement to do specials SPECIFICALLY to nerf bok mages.

    Then you all campaign to remove/reduce the tactics requirement for specials and they do so.

    now suddenly surprise surprise bok mages are a problem...

    they should increase tactics requirement for weapon specials to 70 and 90...

    i hate being so old and watching mistakes repeat in cycles. 

    I don’t like this idea of having things not work if magery is over 70, it was a botch fix for chivalry fast cast and it would really over complicate the already overly complicated game mechanics.

    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
  • The_Higgs_1The_Higgs_1 Posts: 201
    edited October 2018
    Bokuto mages are a problem now due to skill increase bonus with uber gear of today, not cause of tactics change.  They couldn't play that template prior to global loot due to having to sacrifice either resist for parry or parry for resist.
  • Bards can finally be more relevant in a pvp scenario! Hooray!

    However, taking splinter procs from weapon specials disintegrates any hope a classic dexer character has in excelling in a fight; how can someone with a strictly one tile range cause lethal damage if the opponent can't be effectively hindered, save for basic attacks or a focus attack? As someone who started playing UO as such a dexer, it hardly seems balanced and is dissuasive to making and using many templates I've put a lot of love into.
    Further, raising the dexterity need for parry to be relevant hurts nearly every pvp oriented player in the game; parry mages have already had major adjustments from the previous fix, having their damage output reduced by a good portion. A better mechanic to tinker with would be Evasion; as it is people can consistently escape from the most dire of situations without taking as little as a scratch. The more damage that is evaded, the greater the casting cool down should be.

    Skill points are not a problem. As it is now, there are many possible template varieties that keep PvP styles changing and interesting. 
  • CetricCetric Posts: 49
    Honestly that's all splintering probably needed all along - an immunity so it can't get spammed
  • Also we still need more reasons to pvp in felucca besides power scrolls.  Add fel only content please so we can kill each other with a purpose!!  ;)
  • parrymages are so over powered in this game its unreal.  its impossible to kill one as a dexxer 1v1.  every mage has parry that pvps has parry.  how come this doesn't get fixed?  i find it hilarious that cetric is complaining about why your hurting parry mages because thats all him and his guild plays and its barely even a nerf.  drop int 15 and raise dex 15 and back to the normal untouchable parry mage
  • cobbcobb Posts: 163
    edited October 2018
    Splintering no longer proccing on special moves is the worst idea I ever heard of.  It is going to make melee characters completely useless.  And they are already the weakest as it is.

    So now that melee characters are getting a huge nerf and parry mages only getting a slight nerf, parry mages will be a lot stronger vs dexers.  They only have to give up 15 mana, while melee characters will basically lose all their offense and killing ability without the ability to splinter on specials. Unless the other player loses connection, it its nearly impossible to get a kill using a 1 tile melee character, because they will just get kited all day.

    in the recent pvp discussions it seems there were a lot of complaints about parry mages. Well now with this nerf to splintering, parry mages will be even stronger in comparison and will probably dominate pvp.


  • cobbcobb Posts: 163
    Please change the splintering nerf. Don't remove from all from specials. Do as Cetric suggested and add an immunity timer instead.

    Without splintering, all dexers will become archers. why use melee if there is no splintering? And now we will go back to the horrible era of pvp being dominated by archers and parry mages.
  • KingOfPvPKingOfPvP Posts: 2
    edited October 2018
    I think it's a super stupid idea to remove Splinter from the specials!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I mean...if you guys pvp (as I do), it's almost impossible to kill good players 1vs1 nowadays if they decide to heal and move. 

    The only way to kill people is to get a good splinter off. You're doing everything to remove the possibility to kill someone 1vs1 .

    Think about melee toons....how the hell can they kill someone if they cannot splinter????

    Please, rethink about this, it's a very very bad idea.

    Put a cool down of 5 seconds between the splinter specials,that would make sense, so you cannot get two splinters in a row. Other things are totally not related to UO PVP.

    P.s. also please explain me how a BARD could remove the skill increase from jewels etC? I mean we build toons with resist spells on jewels sometimes... imagine when you get ganked by big groups, they all can have a bard who removes all the bonuses from a suit, and you can get para spammed and ganked.

    It's another stupid idea, no sense at all, and  it requires absolutely NO skill to use a passive bard skill other than targetting a player ( so imagine if you have skill inc...the toon is useless after, imagine if you have dex increase to get the parry working ....you cannot pvp because someone targets you...it DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE)

    It doesn' t make any sense. Put at least a spell to be casted with a cool down of 10 minutes at least, but still...Barding skills belong to PvM. 
  • Splintering should of never even been put in game, dexers just fine wrecking people prior to splinter.   This is a step in the right direction but I think splintering should be target based and have a small immunity.  Parry needs a better nerf though, dex thing wont many difference.  Parry needs adjusted according to casting schools.  You shouldn't be able to have ranged offense thats guaranteed damage with best defense.  Lower parry chance by 15 when combined with casting schools (including chivalry).   Noone needs splintering to pvp, people just crutch on it cause its OP.
  • So how exactly will one be able to splinter someone now?

    Will it have to be a full moon?... on a week day?.. between the hours of 3 and 6pm EST?, and Mercury has to be in retrograde?

    bye bye diversity.... bye bye one tiler
  • Would like to add onto the suggestion I had made for evasion: "the more damage evaded that would be dealt by player, the longer the cool down to cast evasion again, scaling from 20 seconds to 60 seconds."
    This would prevent players from just spamming evasion like they have been for the past few years.
  • cobbcobb Posts: 163
    also the discord thing is an incredibly horrible idea as well, but not nearly as bad as removing splintering from specials
  • cobbcobb Posts: 163

    bye bye diversity.... bye bye one tiler
    exactly. Now we will go back to pvp consisting of mostly parry mages and archers.

     :| 
  • The only changes that should have been made are the following <span>:smile:</span>

    1) nerf fire pies ( and others that anyway...are not really used) 

    2) higher DCI cap for templates that don't use PARRY skill, this way, people can start playing again without parry without getting slaughtered in a big fight in 5 seconds.
  • TailTail Posts: 8
    edited October 2018
    Remember doing my idea of:
    #1 Change the Parry formula to give less chance to parry based on certain conditions like: {Pseudo Code]
    •      if (player hasParried in the last 10 seconds) {players parry % chance is equal to 10% for 10 seconds.}

    Perhaps even a better fix is every-time u parry in 10 seconds lowers your chance to parry by a % until it reaches 0 or until the 10 seconds are over.
    Fixes Evasion also. =]
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 1,113
    KingOfPvP said:
    please explain me how a BARD could remove the skill increase from jewels etC? I mean we build toons with resist spells on jewels sometimes... imagine when you get ganked by big groups, they all can have a bard who removes all the bonuses from a suit, and you can get para spammed and ganked.

    It's another stupid idea, no sense at all, and  it requires absolutely NO skill to use a passive bard skill other than targetting a player ( so imagine if you have skill inc...the toon is useless after, imagine if you have dex increase to get the parry working ....you cannot pvp because someone targets you...it DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE)

    It doesn' t make any sense. Put at least a spell to be casted with a cool down of 10 minutes at least, but still...Barding skills belong to PvM. 
    What are you talking about? Some of my chars have 0 + skill items at all, so some guy's 120 music and 120 discord is not exactly going to be great.

    If you can't pvp without the +15 meditation from your jewelry, you need to re-evaluate your skills.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002
This discussion has been closed.