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Classic Client Macro Editor...would it be possible to improve it please ?

poppspopps Posts: 4,039
in General Discussions
The Macro Editor in the Classic Client, to my opinion, is not even remotedly comparable to that in the Enhanced Client.... it is way inferior, to my viewing....

Question is, could it be improved please ?

At least, make it possible to EDIT (change) macros without having them mess up....

So far, if I have to edit an existing macro, I need to delete the old one and make a totally new one because if I make changes to the existing one, it messes up and no longer work....

Also, why for chained up macros there is such a shortage of lines ?

Currently, a Macro can only have 10 lines, period.

If one was to be wanting to make a Macro that required more then 10 commands it is not possible...

Could it be please possible to do something also here to add more command lines as possible in a Macro ?

But in general, the Classic Client Macro system is quite non user friendly, at least to my viewing and, at least, when comparing it to the Enhanced Client Macro Editor....

Yet, a Macro Editor is quite a relevant and important part of a game, I would imagine.

Anyways, some significant love to enhancing and bettering the Macro Editor for the Classic Client would be welcomed, I need to imagine, by all those players who prefer to play the Classic Client over the Enhanced one.... and who do not want to use Third Party programs for their Macros.....

Thanks.
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Comments

  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    edited August 2020
    popps said:

    At least, make it possible to EDIT (change) macros without having them mess up....

    So far, if I have to edit an existing macro, I need to delete the old one and make a totally new one because if I make changes to the existing one, it messes up and no longer work....



    They are working on this issue for 2 years+ , must be a really tough one.



    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • Estel_RandirEstel_Randir Posts: 189
    One of my main issues with the CC macro interface is that it is ridiculously hard to read. The drop down menu text combined with the very strange background makes it very difficult to read especially at the higher resolutions. There should be stark contrast between the two. The text should be true black on a white or cream colored background for easy reading.

    Also the fact that you have to mouse scroll through every option on the drop down menu's is very frustrating. The options added are chronological. So if I want to choose an option recently added, I have to scroll to the bottom every time. There needs to be a more standard type of drop down system where you would choose the action & then sub options pop up. For example the base option you choose spell casting --> then spell school (magery, etc) --> then finally the list of spells.

    If I remember correctly, the EC macro system is not a straight forward system. It is an object oriented macro system that makes you go through several more steps than a "standard" type system. If you revise the CC macro system, please keep it straight forward.
  • Garth_GreyGarth_Grey Posts: 1,459
    I wish more people would either get a better computer, or see their doctor about their vertigo/seizure/fibromylgia or whatever other reasons they come up with, and just download and try the EC instead of always asking for an antiquated client to constantly be updated to keep up with the times.
    You and Several Others like this.


    Please make the Grizzled Mare a 5 slot mount, it's incredibly rare and deserves it. Some of us have been waiting a long time for this simple addition.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    Please tell me what doctor fixes fugly 
  • MariahMariah Posts: 3,302Moderator
    Please stay on topic.
  • poppspopps Posts: 4,039
    edited August 2020
    I wish more people would either get a better computer, or see their doctor about their vertigo/seizure/fibromylgia or whatever other reasons they come up with, and just download and try the EC instead of always asking for an antiquated client to constantly be updated to keep up with the times.
    For me, the preference of the Classic Client over the Enhanced Client is not a matter of Computer, I could be using a top notch Supercomputer and still prefer playing on the Classic Client rather then the Enhanced Client.... and no, it is neither for Third Party apps, saved the exception of the long time ago approved UOAssist....

    I just cannot get used to the Enhanced Client Graphics, likely it is because I have been used to the Classic Client "look" for a good time but anyways, what I would really love is the Enhanced Client "interface" with its Macros and all that, but with the looks of the Classic Client graphics....

    I am still hoping that maybe one day it will be possible to "switch" the Enhanced Client Graphics to that of the Classic Client.... like having an enhanced Enhanced Client that was to offer to players the alternative options of either using the standard Enhanced Client Graphics OR the Legacy Classic Client Graphics....

    At that point, I could end using the Classic Client for good and migrate to the "New" Enhanced client but keeping the Graphics "looks" of the Classic Client....

    Oh well....
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,269
    edited August 2020
    I wish more people would either get a better computer, or see their doctor about their vertigo/seizure/fibromylgia or whatever other reasons they come up with, and just download and try the EC instead of always asking for an antiquated client to constantly be updated to keep up with the times.
    Looking at a screenshot of EC makes me dizzy and get a headache.  I have never seen anything else on the internet that does it.

    What should I tell my doctor, oh wise one, I have an appointment in two weeks.
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • DrakelordDrakelord Posts: 1,792
    I cannot play the EC either.  Playing live in EC also causes me to get Dizzy as well, at times the room spins, its as if I am falling out of my chair.  The constant movement in game is also a nail in this EC client coffin, then there is the art, its as bad or worse then the older 3D they pass to us to play in Ilsh.  About the only thing I like about the EC art is the paper dolls, at least it does not move or sit down like that old one did.

    I rather play the CC because of the art, and they have made some really good changes to the options with instant dress being a part of the CC now.  I love to see options that allow us to do stuff like fill a spell book with one or two clicks like they can do in EC.  Maybe someday, till then I will keep clicking.
    Remove Trap = Bad News
    for
    Treasure Hunters
  • vortexvortex Posts: 220
    Played on EC since day one and no dizzyness....*shrugs shoulders*
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,269
    Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

    I have something wittier to say but it would go too far.  I'll stick with intellectual.
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    edited August 2020
    For me, EC is not about the looks, its the zoomable window, macro, actions, hotbar, map, character sheet, loyalty info, ease of changing macro and shortcuts really quick, etc. 

    Compare CC without any of the 3rd party program, which I think not many of them are approved. I only know UOA since day one, and not sure even if it's updated. 

    If its motion sickness in the moving window, then replace the background with CC terrain? 

    Animal and monster graphic wise, I will sacrifice to let EC follow CC just to keep all above functions. But I won't agree graphics are better, everyone has their own taste.

    Just the horse alone, CC is all same graphic with different colors for faction or normal horse. In EC they are huge difference. The CC horse front leg and back leg walk like 2 man front and back, EC looks correct it just need to sync better with background when galloping.

    CC swampy is so fat, I don't mind the EC swampy with 6 legs but I think it will run like an Ant not horse. But at least it looks more lean and mean, not fat and clumsy.
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • LacrimaLacrima Posts: 20
    Switched from CC to EC because graphic is more fluid, map is really much better and backpack organizer is amazing. 
    I have played first time when there was only cc and I have a special link with that world but EC brought fresh air with some useful improvements.
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    edited August 2020
    Lacrima said:
    Switched from CC to EC because graphic is more fluid, map is really much better and backpack organizer is amazing. 
    I have played first time when there was only cc and I have a special link with that world but EC brought fresh air with some useful improvements.

    You are right, I missed out the most important part, backpack and containers. I don't know even remember how I managed to arrange 125 items inside that small little square.

    CC without 3rd party prog is almost unplayable. It cannot find loots as fast as a native EC user with the standard backpack - I just search for legendary and removed them easily. Or use an agent to auto loot all jewels - lightweight loot to unravel. All these functions are available in vanilla EC client with no add on, no Pinco, nothing.

    So updating:
    For me, EC is not about the looks, its the 
    • backpack
    • zoomable window,
    • macro,
    • actions,
    • agents (scavenger, etc)
    • hotbar,
    • map,
    • character sheet,
    • loyalty info,
    • ease of changing macro and shortcuts really quick

    Yeah they are not the best and there are still bugs. I think it is because Dev time is spent on supporting 2 clients. If they can just focus on making one good, I think this will be much better.

    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • LacrimaLacrima Posts: 20
    Yeah I returned with CC but a lot of things have changed in a better way and EC in my opinion is a great improvement. For example I had to put looted bandages on the others and it was very difficult and same thing for money, especially during a fighting. U couldn't heal yourself if u were putting a item in your backpack. 
    Now everything is easier: double click. It's a pleasure this way. 

  • poppspopps Posts: 4,039
    Lacrima said:
    Switched from CC to EC because graphic is more fluid, map is really much better and backpack organizer is amazing. 
    I have played first time when there was only cc and I have a special link with that world but EC brought fresh air with some useful improvements.
    I like everything the Enhanced Client offer BUT its Graphics.

    I just cannot stand its Graphics SO much, that I stick with the Classic Client even though I know that the Enhanced Client has so much more to offer in terms of movement speed, interface with Macros and all that.

    If only there was an option to be able for the Enhanced Client to load the Legacy, Classic Client Graphics art.....
  • LacrimaLacrima Posts: 20
    the graphic is more fluid in my opinion, especially in combat and a friend of mine (I have still not tried) told me that navigating by ship with EC is completely a whole new level rather then CC.
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    popps said:
    Lacrima said:
    Switched from CC to EC because graphic is more fluid, map is really much better and backpack organizer is amazing. 
    I have played first time when there was only cc and I have a special link with that world but EC brought fresh air with some useful improvements.
    I like everything the Enhanced Client offer BUT its Graphics.

    I just cannot stand its Graphics SO much, that I stick with the Classic Client even though I know that the Enhanced Client has so much more to offer in terms of movement speed, interface with Macros and all that.

    If only there was an option to be able for the Enhanced Client to load the Legacy, Classic Client Graphics art.....
    Ok @popps If they ever decide to grant you your wish... I request to keep only the swampy in EC.
    I cannot bear my warrior riding a dragon that looks like a cucumber in CC.
    All other CC graphics are OK for me as long as they keep EC functions, but I don't know about the other EC players.


    As for the hiryu, I still prefer the EC but I know how some players hated it.
    Its not a big deal as I do not ride hiryu often, but do hunt them once a while.




    My gut feel is that the achilles heel of CC client is not the graphics, but the 3rd party program.
    If they are no longer working and supported, how many players will feel lost and quit? If 50% of the players rely on CC today, does it mean the fate of UO lies on these 3rd party? Or should Broadsword start to look at them seriously and maybe make their own software to support those functions in CC. Just thinking out loud.



    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • Garth_GreyGarth_Grey Posts: 1,459
    High Seas graphics on the EC are way better than CC, but even those could be improved upon. The macros you can do in EC are sweet..the game speed seems way faster to me. Pop up health bars for mobiles is pretty nice..the alerts for different buffs/debuffs is nice , I never could get Pincos to work right, but I know his bells and whistles are pretty good.
    You and Several Others like this.


    Please make the Grizzled Mare a 5 slot mount, it's incredibly rare and deserves it. Some of us have been waiting a long time for this simple addition.
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    edited August 2020
    High Seas graphics on the EC are way better than CC, but even those could be improved upon. The macros you can do in EC are sweet..the game speed seems way faster to me. Pop up health bars for mobiles is pretty nice..the alerts for different buffs/debuffs is nice , I never could get Pincos to work right, but I know his bells and whistles are pretty good.

    Yes, I played other modern games like Totalwar, CS, Assassin's Creed, etc. EC is actually quite ok not the most modern but not far behind.

    CC really looks like the 90s. Can CC attract new players better or EC?

    They can play the vanilla EC without add on. I do shadowguard, osiredon, dark father, all events, champspawn, etc on vanilla EC. I don't have to worry about 3rd party not updated. I just have to post the bugs to one forum (paid sub and yet bug response is really slow imho).

    In my opinion CC is really tough without any 3rd party software.

    So tomorrow I will introduce a younger friend to play using CC... first thing he has to do is download and pay for UOA or find another free 3rd party to start building his first GM mage.
    I would not elaborate but most of you CC veteran players should know.


    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • poppspopps Posts: 4,039
    Seth said:
    popps said:
    Lacrima said:
    Switched from CC to EC because graphic is more fluid, map is really much better and backpack organizer is amazing. 
    I have played first time when there was only cc and I have a special link with that world but EC brought fresh air with some useful improvements.
    I like everything the Enhanced Client offer BUT its Graphics.

    I just cannot stand its Graphics SO much, that I stick with the Classic Client even though I know that the Enhanced Client has so much more to offer in terms of movement speed, interface with Macros and all that.

    If only there was an option to be able for the Enhanced Client to load the Legacy, Classic Client Graphics art.....
    Ok @ popps If they ever decide to grant you your wish... I request to keep only the swampy in EC.
    I cannot bear my warrior riding a dragon that looks like a cucumber in CC.
    All other CC graphics are OK for me as long as they keep EC functions, but I don't know about the other EC players.


    As for the hiryu, I still prefer the EC but I know how some players hated it.
    Its not a big deal as I do not ride hiryu often, but do hunt them once a while.




    My gut feel is that the achilles heel of CC client is not the graphics, but the 3rd party program.
    If they are no longer working and supported, how many players will feel lost and quit? If 50% of the players rely on CC today, does it mean the fate of UO lies on these 3rd party? Or should Broadsword start to look at them seriously and maybe make their own software to support those functions in CC. Just thinking out loud.



    Well, the "ideal" scenario would be, to my opinion, that which provided to players a "new" Enhanced Client with the "option" to either have it run with the Standard Enhanced Client Graphics which we have now, OR, the Legacy Classic Client Graphics....

    This way, both Graphics' lovers would get their cup of tea....

    As in regards to Third Party users, well, the Ehnhanced Client already offers a lot of the functionalities of some of those Third Parties, sure, not the most "extreme" ones but, personally, I see that as a good thing...

    I mean, a few weeks ago, on Atlantic, there was on General Chat a discussion about Clients with obviously some siding with and and some other players siding with the other, and one players who said he liked the Classic Client and, apparently, if I understood it as right, said that he or she was running it along with one of those Third Party apps which cannot be named and that it basically did it to be competitive with those players using the Enhanced Client....

    That is, it was my understanding, the point that he (or she) was trying to make is that basically the Enhanced Client functionality was "close" to that of several Third Party applications out there...

    While I do think that several Third Party apps used along with the Classic Client are far beyond what the Enhanced Client can permit a player to do, my point is though another, I think that most users, if they can get to use the old Classic Client Graphics with the Enhanced Client interface and functionalities, would have no issue, for the most part, in renouncing to use the Third Party apps which they were using with the Classic Client.... 

    Sure, there will be players who would be losing the "extreme" scripting which some of those Third Party apps out there can offer, but in the end, I would imagine that they would not be such a high number to affect Ultima Online....

    Most Classic Client UO players, I think, use UOAssist, that's it.

    And the Enhanced Client interface is already quite more "expanded" as that of UOAssist.

    Sure, I love the ability to record a Macro in UOAssist which is not possible with the Enhanced Client but, once one can learn how to create a Macro in the Enhanced Client, it is not that much bad....

    Anyways, that is at least how I see it.
  • MargeMarge Posts: 722
    edited August 2020
    Seth said:


    In my opinion CC is really tough without any 3rd party software.

    It's not. I have played it for 20 years and never even used UOAssist.
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    Marge said:
    Seth said:


    In my opinion CC is really tough without any 3rd party software.

    It's not. I have played it for 20 years and never even used UOAssist.

    I am not saying the game cannot be played if there is no 3rd party, but it is tough.
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    popps said:
    Seth said:
    popps said:
    Lacrima said:
    Switched from CC to EC because graphic is more fluid, map is really much better and backpack organizer is amazing. 
    I have played first time when there was only cc and I have a special link with that world but EC brought fresh air with some useful improvements.
    I like everything the Enhanced Client offer BUT its Graphics.

    I just cannot stand its Graphics SO much, that I stick with the Classic Client even though I know that the Enhanced Client has so much more to offer in terms of movement speed, interface with Macros and all that.

    If only there was an option to be able for the Enhanced Client to load the Legacy, Classic Client Graphics art.....
    Ok @ popps If they ever decide to grant you your wish... I request to keep only the swampy in EC.
    I cannot bear my warrior riding a dragon that looks like a cucumber in CC.
    All other CC graphics are OK for me as long as they keep EC functions, but I don't know about the other EC players.


    As for the hiryu, I still prefer the EC but I know how some players hated it.
    Its not a big deal as I do not ride hiryu often, but do hunt them once a while.




    My gut feel is that the achilles heel of CC client is not the graphics, but the 3rd party program.
    If they are no longer working and supported, how many players will feel lost and quit? If 50% of the players rely on CC today, does it mean the fate of UO lies on these 3rd party? Or should Broadsword start to look at them seriously and maybe make their own software to support those functions in CC. Just thinking out loud.



    Well, the "ideal" scenario would be, to my opinion, that which provided to players a "new" Enhanced Client with the "option" to either have it run with the Standard Enhanced Client Graphics which we have now, OR, the Legacy Classic Client Graphics....

    This way, both Graphics' lovers would get their cup of tea....

    As in regards to Third Party users, well, the Ehnhanced Client already offers a lot of the functionalities of some of those Third Parties, sure, not the most "extreme" ones but, personally, I see that as a good thing...

    I mean, a few weeks ago, on Atlantic, there was on General Chat a discussion about Clients with obviously some siding with and and some other players siding with the other, and one players who said he liked the Classic Client and, apparently, if I understood it as right, said that he or she was running it along with one of those Third Party apps which cannot be named and that it basically did it to be competitive with those players using the Enhanced Client....

    That is, it was my understanding, the point that he (or she) was trying to make is that basically the Enhanced Client functionality was "close" to that of several Third Party applications out there...

    While I do think that several Third Party apps used along with the Classic Client are far beyond what the Enhanced Client can permit a player to do, my point is though another, I think that most users, if they can get to use the old Classic Client Graphics with the Enhanced Client interface and functionalities, would have no issue, for the most part, in renouncing to use the Third Party apps which they were using with the Classic Client.... 

    Sure, there will be players who would be losing the "extreme" scripting which some of those Third Party apps out there can offer, but in the end, I would imagine that they would not be such a high number to affect Ultima Online....

    Most Classic Client UO players, I think, use UOAssist, that's it.

    And the Enhanced Client interface is already quite more "expanded" as that of UOAssist.

    Sure, I love the ability to record a Macro in UOAssist which is not possible with the Enhanced Client but, once one can learn how to create a Macro in the Enhanced Client, it is not that much bad....

    Anyways, that is at least how I see it.

    I think those that played PVP use mainly CC and they all use 3rd party like automap to track each other's location. See the videos on youtube and you know they all use 3rd party, HP popping over their heads.

    Another reason I heard from them, it has to do with the targeting method which they say is faster in CC. So if EC functions + CC graphics, I am not sure what will be the final outcome.
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,269
    I did this comparison a long time ago so I have the pics.

    IMO EC pet models are horrible.  





    And my eyes are burning just from looking at the EC still shots.
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • LacrimaLacrima Posts: 20

    Ok @ popps If they ever decide to grant you your wish... I request to keep only the swampy in EC.
    I cannot bear my warrior riding a dragon that looks like a cucumber in CC.
    All other CC graphics are OK for me as long as they keep EC functions, but I don't know about the other EC players.


    As for the hiryu, I still prefer the EC but I know how some players hated it.
    Its not a big deal as I do not ride hiryu often, but do hunt them once a while.




    My gut feel is that the achilles heel of CC client is not the graphics, but the 3rd party program.
    If they are no longer working and supported, how many players will feel lost and quit? If 50% of the players rely on CC today, does it mean the fate of UO lies on these 3rd party? Or should Broadsword start to look at them seriously and maybe make their own software to support those functions in CC. Just thinking out loud.



    ahahah you made my laugh out loud.
    I think that talking about functions all people would admit that EC client is much more useful. 
    Talking about graphic some people could not like EC, but how can u play high seas with cc? I tried it and it's terrible.
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    edited August 2020
    Pawain said:
    I did this comparison a long time ago so I have the pics.

    IMO EC pet models are horrible.  

    And my eyes are burning just from looking at the EC still shots.
    Aye, beauty is in the eye of the beholder... I still say the swampy in EC is correct, I like horses in EC better and shape matches other modern game as well.

    While I still think CC needs updating, I will be fair to critique the EC as well. E.g. For EC hiryu, I dislike the wings... at the angle above they look like weird butterfly wings. But that does not make me vote for CC hiryu. Both look bad.

    The EC Triton reminds me of a Leech. I have yet to find the urge to train one today because of the looks.

    Back to the topic, As what @popps propose perhaps it would be good if the EC can have a switch to select legacy or EC graphics. 
    - 2 client merges into 1
    - Dev just need to spend time on 1 client.

    Then we open up, what are those 3rd party and functions that need to be included. 
    It will also make EC better.

    But I don’t think all these will happen.
    EC will remain buggy, and no new functions for years to come.
    2 clients will stay.

    And we all wasted time to write so much.


    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    edited August 2020

    Lacrima said:
    ahahah you made my laugh out loud.
    I think that talking about functions all people would admit that EC client is much more useful. 
    Talking about graphic some people could not like EC, but how can u play high seas with cc? I tried it and it's terrible.
    I guess popps is right to propose a switch for legacy or EC, but it’s unlikely to happen. 
    We just have to bear with a buggy EC. It is powerful but it has no improvements or new features for a Long time. 
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • AragornAragorn Posts: 293
    I think asking UO to fix the Macro editor in CC is like you now ask Microsoft to fix a bug in Windows 95
  • SethSeth Posts: 2,926
    Aragorn said:
    I think asking UO to fix the Macro editor in CC is like you now ask Microsoft to fix a bug in Windows 95
    This is a good analogy. :D
    If it ain't broke, don't fix it. 
    ESRB warning: Some Blood. LOTS of Alcohol. Some Violence. LOTS of Bugs
  • LacrimaLacrima Posts: 20
    Aragorn said:
    I think asking UO to fix the Macro editor in CC is like you now ask Microsoft to fix a bug in Windows 95
    This is true of course, eventually devs could improve EC as Seth said.

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