UO not noob friendly
I know this has been talked about but as a returning vet I must say , Im pretty discouraged. I opened two accts and bought a few ex packs but not sure if it was worth it. The game is not geared towards new players or old ones. The inflation is off the charts, the old dungeons are out of control. Shame used to be fun but now its just way to much. It was a great dungeon you had nice levels of play all the way through. New players ,unless coming in to one of the few guilds left wont stay long. I get change happens and blah blah but some things are just to much. Oh well it is what is, stay or go it wont matter, but for a game that could use some new blood , changing back a few things would help new players and retain the feel of old UO that alot of people miss. Dont go off on my opinion , its just that ,an opinion of one old vet.
Comments
This is the result of extreme itemization of the game.
Veteran players keep piling up items which are increasingly more powerfull, and consequentially, the Developers need to put out items more powerfull again to keep Veteran players interested in the game.
Of course, then the MoBs need to be "beefed up" to catch up with these new items more and more powerfull and the end result is that this vicious circle makes it impossible or way too hard for new or returning players to play....
A good step in the right direction was with Masteries, to my opinion, where "real" skill points were made to matter more as compared to item skill points, but it has not been enough, me thinks.
It is necessary to progressively make items less important and real skills more important...
Perhaps an idea could be to have "super Masteries", that is, Masteries not tied up to only 1 skill, but tied up to a combination of skills so as to force players, if they wanted to use the advantages from these Super Masteries, to have to invest on their Templates in "real" skill points not for just 1 skill, but for 4 or 5 or even 6 skills.....
Recently the New Legacy Server was announced and, supposedly, players will all have a "new" start there thus voiding the current difference between Veteran players and new and returning players, but no release date has been given so, I am not sure how far it might be.
I do not like the importance that has been given over the Years to items in Ultima Online.... I much more preferred the way that it was back in the days, where regular armor and weapons where used....
I am not sure how this situation could be reversed and thus deprive items of their current importance, but I sure would love to see Ultima Online go back to a game where items did not have the importance that they have now, on a template.
You are completely correct, I agree.
I'm going to disagree with Popp's version of events, where of course it is the Veteran players to blame for all of this. Boring, and wrong.
For the last few months, I have been playing the game with my 2 boys, a 9 year old, and a 12 year old, and the main problem with UO is, there is absolutely no road-map for a new player. They are intelligent kids, who happily take on many new games and succeed in them, but they have both said, they wouldn't have known where to start in UO, there is absolutely no manual.
There is no structure.
There is no linking skill gains, or template choice, with a suitable level mob or monster to get the relevant armour or gear off, to feel you are progressing in a uniform manner. Quite often Skills training has to be done first, and independently of gaining armour, as the Mobs to gain items off are way too hard for new players.
The Devs did try and sort out the Quest engine a little, it's better, but still not greatly useful.
New Haven works as a starter point, but then where do they go? My 2 boys started gargoyles alongside 1 I created with them to experience the journey with them, and there was nowhere for them to hunt, where they could get any sort of mobs their level, to help them gear up. It's taken a Vet of my ability, to try and create a fun and structured road-map for them.
This is my Road-Map so far, and I'd love to see any New or Returning Player come up with this intuitively;
So @dara or any other new/returning player - this is how I approached it, I tried to do a lot of it myself where I could, but I did get a lot of guild help, from a Veteran guild. Maybe this can help for ideas and a progression path.
I'm going to agree with this post also, this is how to do it.
Ultima Online is a team game, it's really designed to help each other progress. Going solo is not easy at all.
We as a guild, help a lot of new players progress, we need the activity levels for our hunts, we need PvPers for Felucca, new players benefit by getting the rewards of our efforts.
The difficulty is, there are often far more new players, than there are structured guilds who can help them, we can only take in so many, and we have to stay balanced. We also cannot get items as fast as people think we can, we often get asked for Legendary this and that, especially jewellery, which costs say 200m and we don't even have to hand ourselves. New player requirements and expectations can be quite high, or unrealistic, they do not always appreciate how hard it is to get stuff for them.
I do completely agree and understand this - but, this is why they are having to create the New Legacy Shard, to simplify down the introduction to the game.
When we started, there was so much less, and it was easier to get into.
Since then, we have 23 years of accumulated knowledge and systems all built on top of each other and going different directions, with many systems/quests/skills/templates/items even being obsolete.
How is a new player going to know where to go, or how to progress.
It would really help if there was more structure at the front end, you really have to play it in the way I have been, with new players, to experience this.
My 9 year old instantaneously wanted to be a Tamer, Necro, Mystic, Rogue right off the bat, without really having any clue what any of this involved or how to get there.
What if the "Newcomer" wants to be a Tamer ? Or a Bard ? Or a Thief ? And on and on with the many Templates possible in Ultima Online....
And even for a Dexer, the items change, depending on "what type" of a Dexer one wants to play...
A Sampire ? A Paladin ? A Dragoon ? And there is quite a few more... and the farming for their suit pieces would change, depending on what type of Template the player would want to play and enjoy...
What lacks, really, is Guidance to :
# 1) - A Comprehensive listing of all of the Templates and "hybrid" Templates possible in Ultima Online ;
# 2) - What Armor and Weapons items would be needed (and where to find them) in accordance to the type of Template or Hybrid Template that the new or returning player has chosen to play.
Or, I should say, this information might be existing, somewhere hidden in some players' site or in some Post, maybe from Years ago.... what does not exist, that I know of, is a single place where one could find all of these info in one single place....
Possibly, the UO Wiki could be a good place to gather such informations but it would need first @Mariah to be willing to implement these informations, and then Veteran players, each having experience and knowledge in a given Template, to provide to her such informations as to how to make a Sampire, with what skills, stats, gear, weapons, and where to farm for those items, or a Dragoon, or an ABC Archer, or a whatever, and still provide to Mariah the related informations which she could then all put on the UO Wiki for New and Returning players to find them all in 1 single place and then pick the Template which they think they can most enjoy and go from their on their Ultima Online's new Journey....
It would require a comprehensive effort from Veteran players knowledged about all of these high end Templates and Mariah, all contributing to put these info in 1 single spot, the UO Wiki.
Never be afraid to challenge the status quo
Never be afraid to challenge the status quo
I completely know and understand the points that my road-map was for 1 style of template, there are many styles of template, but a lot of the basics would be the same, just with a different places to visit for different slots.
I also get that you can use many variations, and there are variations upon variations.
To a large degree, this is where the complication comes in.
None of this is relevant to the point I was making, I get all this, but what is true is that;
As a new player, with far less skills and abilities, the game does not offer a cohesive route whereby a character with a certain level of skills, can go to get themselves the level of armour or weapons they require in a structured fashion. I know this, because I experienced it.
I think it should be possible to define some of the more popular templates and create guidance for them. If you ask any Vet - I want to make this, or this, or this, they would know in their heads how to progress with that, they would know the options - what I did for my Throwers there, I could equally do with a Mage, a Rogue. A new player just does not stand a chance, and the whole thing is completely overwhelming.
I understand @Mariah ;
I do feel I should help, I have so much in my head, but I don't ever have time to get it out, or I get distracted, or I'm just too busy playing.
I never go onto Test Centre - I don't even know how to use it, I don't pre-test new content - Again - I'm just too busy playing the game.
Ofcourse some of this items can be bought from vendor search on some shards (not all shards), but as a new/returning player you wont learn anything buying of the vendors.
Hi @psycho
I completely agree - it is not for new players, but that is the list that is required to create basic Throwers - with some of the basic must have items that players want for their characters.
That is exactly my point, the Hunting of Items and Gear - does not correlate with the level of Skills of a Character. There is a complete void/disconnect in the game, in terms of what they would be after, and when they can actually try to attain it.
I agree with you in terms of your basic list, there are some items that should be scaled better within the game. The place they are obtained from, should be lower level.
I think a new solo player should be able to go so far, and have a more structured introduction.
Then of course, it's about group and teamplay to progress further.
Edit - PS - It was a list for 3 new players acting as a team. 2 Gargoyle Thrower damage dealers, and a Gargoyle Mystic Parry Mage acting as support healer. The emphasis has been on teamwork from the start. And yes, even then, we needed help from a Veteran guild. When I first started the game all those years ago, I teamed up with 2 other guys, and we formed a solid friendship and that is how we progressed, I also met @petra-fyde in those days.
I get your scepticism, but the 3 of us, have played all of that together from brand new EJ accounts. What I have not mentioned in there is the timescale, and how long and detailed each part has been. I've bullet pointed it, and made it look like we achieved each of those points in a day, when each point probably took a month.
A lot of players/crafters give away basic imbued/LRC suits to help new players - our guild do this for many players, and many new people we recruit. Petra's guild do similar.
Veteran players are all sat there with many Legendary items, it is nothing for them to throw together a suit.
We have done Champion Spawns, but again, our guild as a Champ Spawn guild, farm so many, have so many in stock, and give away Plats worth of these to new/returning players.
We take Harry teams of 20 players a time. Often say 5-10 PvPers for protection, and 10-15 PvMers, the PvMers are often by default new players who are there for the scrolls, they are not being carried if they are helping to kill the Harry. But again, yes we carry many new players, through all aspects of the game, it's what large Champ Spawn guilds do, those guilds everyone criticizes all the time, because they perceive they are dominating the market, and selling everything for huge profits, when we are giving most of it away.
For most vets who were around back in 97-99... think about the difference between the top tier armor and the basic looted armor off something like an orc or ettin. There was some differences, but the gap was not the Grand Canyon it is today. I feel like there needs to be some quests in between the 50 skill and 90 skill levels that provide true usable pieces based on the basic templates.
For example:
Replace the starting spell book for a mage with an empty base scrappers.
NPC mage in Haven sells all scrolls through 4th circle.
NPC mage offers 3 additional quests: Journeyman, Adept and Expert Mage. Journeyman gets you all 5th and 6th circle spells at 55 magery... adept gets you all 7th circle at 70 and expert gets you all 8th level spells at 80. (Quests can be completed once per character to avoid abuse).
NPC mage guild master offers additional quests... Apprentice, Advisor and Battle Mage... Apprentice provides a leather 100% lrc suit with 10 lmc and 50 in all resists at 55 magery... Advisor grants 100 lrc with 20 lmc, 60 resists and 30 SDI at 70 skill... Battle Mage would grant a 100 lrc with 30 lmc, 70 in all resists 30 SDI and 1/5 casting at 80 skill. (Same quest restrictions for once per character).
By 80 magery a new player would have a full lrc suit with 40 lmc, 70 in all resists, 2/6 casting and 55 SDI.... still nothing like a 150 SDI legendary/arti based suit, but the gap is smaller and the new player has acquired a decent suit through game play.
@townie - I'd also like to add, I was agreeing with the original poster - this game is very hard for a new player. I've stated there is no structure, the content does not flow, skillgains do not link up with equipment gains.
I've stated there is no obvious progression path, and it's all very confusing for a new player.
What I've done - is give 1 real gameplay example, as to how it could be done, I know it can be done, because this is exactly what I've done, I've been very honest about each step, the good bits, the hard bits, the bits where I've had help, how I got around certain bits.
This is not the only be all and end all example, it is not prescriptive, the point of it was, to give a flavour, and indication of how it could be approached - I was almost showing how hard it was, but also trying to help a player find a way, I hope within there, new or returning players can see and identify steps they can relate to, and could use to their advantage. This method of playing it, did not require any gold, or real life cash to be invested. It did require team-work, it did require joining a Feluccan PvP guild.
As for skipping content, and racing to high end content...
There is far more to go after this!
I did not touch on Virtues, Buffs/DeBuffs, , Consumables, Masteries, Crafting, putting together High-End Armour, and ultimately PvP in Felucca. There is at least a year to go, before they could be considered ready for that. This was about putting together the first basic Dexxer character, to give them an introduction and flavour to the game. After that, when you have more knowledge of what is what, you can start branching out to what may be more your playstyle, knowing you have an all-round basic farming Dexxer in your inventory to go and do all the basic stuff.
Cheers MissE
When I started two years ago there was nothing. I advanced by doing a lot of internet research. There were a few players passing through New Haven now and then that gave me and other players advice, but I don't see them anymore. Don't see many new players either when I pass through New Haven to do the same thing. Really think the times and the players have changed.
Do not really think that every profession needs a detailed player guide. For example, when a player buys training, which by the way is not that easy for a new player since the new player does not have the least idea of how to pay for the training until after doing some internet research, it would be helpful to for new players to have the option to get a little information on how to play the character. For example, the swords trainer could say a little about the qualities a player should look for on a weapon, and maybe provide a little information on how to use it.
Have been playing standalone games since the 1970's and have to admit this is the least helpful to the new player game I have ever played. Don't think that was intentional but that is the way it is.