Poll on Power Scrolls Please Read before voting

The_Higgs_1

Getting PS's is nothing but a choice a player makes.  You can choose to take the chance of running spawns and getting raided so your scrolls are free, or you can stay in safe facets and make your gold doing any of the content there and then buying the scrolls you need.  There is nothing wrong with PS's being fel only, its a risk v reward option.  If you choose to stay in trammel then live with your decision.

Garth_Grey

Put PS's on the in game store already and be done with it..this is a no brainer.

Bilbo

Garth_Grey said:

Put PS's on the in game store already and be done with it..this is a no brainer.

YES YES YES but could you hear the whining already, LOL.

Garth_Grey

There would whining for a little while from a few  and much rejoicing at EA/BS whoever, when they see the dollars rolling in.

Lord_Frodo

yes and they could still keep their fel spawn but would have to undercut UO to sell them, LOL

Urge

Ivenor said:

The answer, IMO, is making white PS scrolls available ONLY through completion of skill-related Quests, as it is now for Imbuing, and make those Quests NOT REPEATABLE for a specific Char.
Limit the scroll dumps at Spanws to pink SoT and blue SoA, bumpig up the quantity.
My 2 GPs.
I.

No just no. 

General chat on Atlantic there is currently a harrower being unraided on a Friday night during peak play hours so this discussion isn't even worth taking part of.

There is 0 sense in catering to select few that won't even attempt to earn the reward as it currently stands.

Kiera

The_Higgs_1 said:

Getting PS's is nothing but a choice a player makes.  You can choose to take the chance of running spawns and getting raided so your scrolls are free, or you can stay in safe facets and make your gold doing any of the content there and then buying the scrolls you need.  There is nothing wrong with PS's being fel only, its a risk v reward option.  If you choose to stay in trammel then live with your decision.

The last sentence sounds unnecessarily condescending.  My post made it crystal clear I choose Tram over the perverse gauntlet of mistreatment one risks being in Fel.  Long ago I realized I could save up gold, selling some goodies, building my bank to purchase some PSs and other upper end goodies.  My heartfelt lament is that the good part of Pet Imbuing whetted my appetite to earmark applying Pet Points for future PSs and planning on purchasing a number of PSs which is just crushed by disappointment due to the shear lack of PSs to apply to multiple pets!  Pet Imbuing is fantastic, BUT it really skews the PS economy by creating short or nonexistent supply due to high demand not only on my less populated shard but also the larger shards (looking at you Atlantic) players coming over to my shard snapping up what few PSs we have.

When things become unpleasant enough, players... real people spending real money tire of paying it each month (I've paid for three accounts for years) and they walk away from the game.  People can reach a boredom and or breaking point where they go elsewhere for fun time.  I sincerely want this game to stay viable for a long time to come!  I'm not saying I'll stamp my feet in a huff and threaten to quit, but I'm pointing out that people come for interest and novelty, they stay for the fun, and they leave if they are too frustrated.  Fact of life.  The economy of PS availability in light of the huge increase in demand with addition of Pet Imbuing is causing growing frustration when it doesn't feel fair where there is no increase in supply except for the Rich and Alpha PVP player types.  I just want this imbalance in PS economy fixed!  Having Pet Imbuing is like having a fast boat or car where you can never open the throttle up, and with pets effectively limited to GM 100 due to lack of PS supply just seems short sighted if allowed to continue indefinitely at which point... well lets hope the Devs figure out something that will work instead of letting the Rich few or Alpha PVPers bend the Devs completely to their will.

Fix it please!

Thanks!
Kiera,
Legendary Tamer, Lore, Vetting

Cookie

Kiera, I have directly copied a post of mine from Stratics for you, as I believe it is a completely relevant response to all of you in your mindset. I don't want to put you down, I get your thinking, but I genuinely feel it is within your power to do something about it yourself. The obstacles you have built up in your mind, hardly exist.

Here goes;

I mostly do Champ Spawns.
I've always enjoyed them, I mostly do them with my guild, we do a fair few, we are quite an active shard (Europa), but only 4 guilds can be said to do Champ Spawns, W, TUK, DiE and Pro.

Point 1.
Even though I get quite a few scrolls, I don't get so many 20's, it's quite a low drop rate, I rarely get to sell them outside my guild - I either collect, sell a few, or give them to guildies. So whilst it's a major part of my playstyle, there aren't that many to sell out. (So you are best off doing it yourself).

Point 2.
It's like the above poster says, there are very few players actually doing them, if players want them, they can do something about it, they are easy enough to get.

Point 3.
There are 20 Champ Spawn locations. Oaks, Deceit, Despise, Destard, Fire, Turtle, Marble, Damwin, CoD, Ice East, Ice West, Tortoise, Khaldun, Hoppers Bog, Desert, Oasis, Abyssal , Primeevil Lich, Terra and Terra Sanctum. It takes me 15 solid minutes to scout all of these. A Baracoon spawn takes 10 minutes to do. It has happened to me before, that I have scouted every single Champ Spawn, and by the time I've got back to the first one, someone has done it. They are quick to do.

Point 4.
There are 24 hours in a day. No PvPer is so dedicated they are scouting all that time, at max, they will do 2 full scout runs a day. Early mornings, afternoon, late evenings are usually completely left alone.

Point 5.
PvPers usually just want easy PvP, many of them just hang round Yew Gate trolling just to get someone to come to them, they are lazy, or just focused on wanting PvP, 95% do not even scout.

Point 6.
You can even bind them, so it gets easier, it isn't even random, you are almost guaranteed to get there in the end.

Point 7.
Many of them can even be soloed.

Point 8.
Most PvPers only scout maximum 7 spawns. Destard, Despise, Terra, Deceit, Ice East, Ice West, Marble - leaving 13 unscouted at all times.

Point 9.
You just need to be discreet. Maintain radio silence. Don't show up at Luna with your fancy slayer weapon. Don't talk about it in general chat, only talk about it with trusted friends, in private. Don't go leaving evidence you are doing spawns, no primers or equipment dropped on the ground, don't use Star Room, don't all go piling into Luna after a run - PvPers are very good at picking up on these clues. Let the PvPers think it is completely inactive, the moment they know there is activity, they will pay more attention.

Point 10.
Team up with the PvPers. On our shard, our 4 PvP guilds have plenty of PvMers, we need them to get stuff done ourselves! We do also PvM when there is no PvP. Make friends, work as a team. As a Veteran PvP guild, we often have no purpose in the game, so when someone new joins us, and needs stuff, it actually gives us a purpose, and a reason to go out and spawn, pvm, pvp. We need a reason to exist also.

How much more do you want?

I really don't believe there is any excuse for the current lack of Powerscrolls on the market, it's just that players are lazy, and like to whine. We've had quite a few new players join us recently, we do scrolls with them, they join in, no problems. Even for us it's quite slow getting them scrolled up (except Stat scrolls, they are like water for me as we are the best Harry guild in existence ), but like anything, it takes effort. You're all happy spending all day in the Roof, or Doom, or Medusa for your 200m Arties, but struggle to find a way to do something for a 50m item that's really surprisingly easy?

Lieutenant_Dan

Bilbo said:

Garth_Grey said:

Put PS's on the in game store already and be done with it..this is a no brainer.

YES YES YES but could you hear the whining already, LOL.

Anyone else see the irony that the above quotes IS the whining?

Tanager

It is not that difficult to do a champ spawn... I think we can all agree on that. And yes, it's very possible to run one - even several, specially on a low population shard - without getting noticed. That is not the point.

The point is that PvP generally involves a certain degree of aggression. Many (most) PvPers enjoy trash talk and other behavior specifically designed to insult, degrade, and humiliate their opponent. Not every one enjoys this treatment, or finds the risk of it enjoyable. It is not fun. Now, you can call people who avoid doing un-fun things lazy, but the fact remains that people who do enough unenjoyable things end up leaving and playing a game that IS fun to them.

When we just needed an occasional 120 for our main char, it was fine to save up and buy it from those who enjoy the fel champion spawns. Now, tho, we need them for pets. Most tamers have more than 1 trained pet, and most will end up trying different templates. It is a lot of scrolls.

I get that the devs want to improve the allure of PvP for UO. I get that there are lots of folks who enjoy it. But maybe upping the drop rate on the scrolls in fel champs, or adding pet-only ones that can be obtained without the abuse of PvP, is not such a bad idea.

Mervyn

Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's.

And for everyone else, create a fel only shard.

Cookie

Tanager said:

It is not that difficult to do a champ spawn... I think we can all agree on that. And yes, it's very possible to run one - even several, specially on a low population shard - without getting noticed. That is not the point.

The point is that PvP generally involves a certain degree of aggression. Many (most) PvPers enjoy trash talk and other behavior specifically designed to insult, degrade, and humiliate their opponent. Not every one enjoys this treatment, or finds the risk of it enjoyable. It is not fun. Now, you can call people who avoid doing un-fun things lazy, but the fact remains that people who do enough unenjoyable things end up leaving and playing a game that IS fun to them.

When we just needed an occasional 120 for our main char, it was fine to save up and buy it from those who enjoy the fel champion spawns. Now, tho, we need them for pets. Most tamers have more than 1 trained pet, and most will end up trying different templates. It is a lot of scrolls.

I get that the devs want to improve the allure of PvP for UO. I get that there are lots of folks who enjoy it. But maybe upping the drop rate on the scrolls in fel champs, or adding pet-only ones that can be obtained without the abuse of PvP, is not such a bad idea.

Hey Tanager,

You don't have your full set of scrolls for your pets - I don't have my full set of Cameo's, or many other things. It's all a work in progress. I get that you suddenly have a large need, and the game isn't supplying it very fast right now.

But rest assured, is Spawners/PvPers are out there working our butts off for you guys ! Give it time I guess.

In the same way you are for Cameo's, Doom arties, etc.

I'd almost suggest, the price of both could be brought down a long way (Scrolls and Trammel Arties). 50m a scroll, and 200m for a Trammel Arty seem ridiculous.

I just wanted to touch on another aspect of your post. You mention PvPers are aggressive - Yes for sure, quite openly aggressive. Did you know everyone is aggressive? Whether they admit it or not? If you go to Trammel, players are prevented from being openly aggressive, and instead resort to Passive Aggression. Think about how certain players in Trammel react when their spawn is taken - luring anyone? They do it here on these boards (trolling from safety), they do it ingame.

I did a very explicit post on Stratics about this, and earned myself a warning for that one, even though I was completely correct.

My question for you, which is more honest (open or passive aggression?), and I have a strong belief open aggression is far more healthy for you, to get it out there, and not bottle it all in. Look at the state of Trammies, and how they think and act about things, it's dire (Passive Aggression is far more damaging to everyone in the long run, it builds up all these barriers of resentment in the mind, and they create seriously biased thought processes). I know I am veering heavily into psychology here.

Should people be separated, or should they learn to get on?

crunchnasty

look, straight up if you aren't willing to do a champ spawn cause u don't want ur feelings hurt, then go buy the scrolls. don't try to take away one of the last remnants of a dangerous and exciting Felucca because u want everything handed to you. Doing roof runs is way harder than the damn champ spawns, but u guys can't take the time to find and scout the spawns and just deal with PK's? You want the scrolls? Do what it takes or stop complaining about it. 

I've been murked so many times by murderers, and it makes me happy, cause I'm coming back for them one day with a vengeance. I love that there are bad guys, playing the bad guy role. If someone is 'Abusing' you then page a Game Master and report the sucker. 

Trammel has created this world of learned helplessness where people cant even deal with what UO really is, unfiltered and raw. Felucca is the real UO by the way, but most people don't remember before Renaissance apparently, and just love their cake just handed to them. 

Tanager

I play exclusively on Siege Perilous, because I think freedom is the most fun game play. You cannot really predict what people will do, and I find that interesting and fun. On Siege, most people either learn to get along or eventually get driven off the shard (or leave out of boredom because no one will play with them). So, imo, Siege is the most healthy environment :P

In my opinion, the folks who find some sort of outlet for aggression in a game is prolly healthier than looking for an RL fight in a bar somewhere, or a variety of other ways. I have no issue with champ spawns, or the risk of them. For me, I find PvP very distasteful but I can ignore it with little more than an eyeroll.

My comment was more for the people who just do not like PvP, who can't help but get upset by the aggression. They feel like they are forced into PvP in order to get what has become, essentially, a basic need for a tamer (PvM) build. While I personally do not enjoy Trammel, I recognize that the majority of players do. And the majority is what keeps the lights on, including Siege. This thing with PS and their lack of availability is a building pressure bomb imo.

Cookie

Tanager said:

I play exclusively on Siege Perilous, because I think freedom is the most fun game play. You cannot really predict what people will do, and I find that interesting and fun. On Siege, most people either learn to get along or eventually get driven off the shard (or leave out of boredom because no one will play with them). So, imo, Siege is the most healthy environment :P

In my opinion, the folks who find some sort of outlet for aggression in a game is prolly healthier than looking for an RL fight in a bar somewhere, or a variety of other ways. I have no issue with champ spawns, or the risk of them. For me, I find PvP very distasteful but I can ignore it with little more than an eyeroll.

My comment was more for the people who just do not like PvP, who can't help but get upset by the aggression. They feel like they are forced into PvP in order to get what has become, essentially, a basic need for a tamer (PvM) build. While I personally do not enjoy Trammel, I recognize that the majority of players do. And the majority is what keeps the lights on, including Siege. This thing with PS and their lack of availability is a building pressure bomb imo.

Perfect response , you guys on Siege play the game properly, have the right game environment and attitudes.

You've already stated Champ spawns are easy enough, we all know they are. Players can do them without ever being found.

If a player is found, and killed, they can dehumanise it quite effectively, what is the difference between being killed by a boss, or a player in a game? How come one is very acceptable, and no issue, and the other is? So they can pretend it is an NPC killing them, they can place them on ignore, it just becomes a lost hunt, this happenes in PvM also. It makes the feeling of achieving the objective when they do, even more sweet - the reward is far more truly earned.

I believe players can directly get off their backsides, overcome their mental blocks, and go and do something about this. The lack of power-scrolls, is a player driven issue.

crunchnasty

The building presume bomb is the whole point of the scrolls.... they put scrolls in there to bring ppl to fel, trammies just need to adapt to the environment. We fellucans have to go to tram to get legendary gear.

Also, ppl tend to be majority trammies because they are now born in Trammel, and learned everything in Trammel. It is kind of sad actually. Now the real UO world is like this abstract scary thing that nobody wants to participate in. There are only Pk's running around because all the other players let them take Felucca over... Fel needs ppl to come back and start defending the weak, not running to Trammel for cover. 

Cookie

Mervyn said:

Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's.

And for everyone else, create a fel only shard.

I always like a good Julius Ceasar quote.

Alea Iacta Est.

*smiles*

Tanager

I agree with you, Cookie

However, the vast majority of humans on this planet have various levels of hangups and issues (including me lol). Therefor, so do the vast majority of gamers. Siege is no exception - there is plenty of what I consider unhealthy behavior here. As far as gaming goes, I am not interested in trying to change them - it's really not practical.

Instead, I try to understand where they are coming from. Most people just want to log in and take a time out from reality. They want to do their own thing in their own way without interruption, which is why most prefer PvM in Trammel. In an MMO, they can do this with friends. Monsters are predictable and boring, and if I die to one I am actually more annoyed than if I get PKd and drylooted by a player lol. But, to each their own.

There are many pure PvP MMOs out there with maybe a touch of PvM. Other MMOs are 99% PvM with a tiny offering of PvP. The trouble with UO is that it is trying to balance both equally and that is, and always has been, nearly impossible.

Garth_Grey

Holy Crap Tanager is getting complimented on her PvP knowledge...the sky has fallen...ahhhhh :P  and she knows I luvs her...