VvV Item Abuse By Non-VvV Participating Characters

VvV items are being abused in Trammel similar to the old faction gear. Players that have no intention of PVP-ing nor leaving Trammel are able to claim 4 artifacts for free without ever doing anything in the VvV system. These artifacts last a VERY long time despite having the 'Antique' property and are more powerful than their original counterparts. This goes against the spirit of these items and devalues a lot of bosses/content in the game.

I propose two easy changes:
  • No VvV points are given to new characters/guilds joining VvV
  • All VvV artifacts receive an additional "Cannot Be Repaired" tag
Combined both of these changes would impose active participation in the VvV system to continue the use the artifacts.

What's my incentive to get a real Ornament of the Magician? Crystalline Ring? Crimson Cincture? Primer? Etc.


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Comments

  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,048
    They ruined things already by allowing players to start with 2k silver points, people have already made and deleted mass amounts of chars and got all the vvv rewards. Market ruined already. Bit like powerscrolls not shard being shard bound from day 1. 
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • UrgeUrge Posts: 590
    Mervyn said:
    They ruined things already by allowing players to start with 2k silver points, people have already made and deleted mass amounts of chars and got all the vvv rewards. Market ruined already. Bit like powerscrolls not shard being shard bound from day 1. 


    That's odd because VvV arties are character bound. No other character can wear them, ever so there is no market to ruin.

  • KronalKronal Posts: 81
    Urge said:
    Mervyn said:
    They ruined things already by allowing players to start with 2k silver points, people have already made and deleted mass amounts of chars and got all the vvv rewards. Market ruined already. Bit like powerscrolls not shard being shard bound from day 1. 


    That's odd because VvV arties are character bound. No other character can wear them, ever so there is no market to ruin.

    Why let facts get in the way of an argument (:
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,048
    edited December 2018
    I said vvv rewards, not talking about artis, I mean the decos and royal pardons worth 10k silver points each. And supanovas. They are not char bound.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • I don't think you can get any of the Deco or Royal pardons for 2k. The supernovas for Sure I could see being an issue, but I am an advocate for the artifacts and the free 2k points in VvV. The artifacts are antique and don't last very long in medium combat, but can make it easier on new and returning players starting with nothing. 

  • King_Greg said:
    I am an advocate for the artifacts and the free 2k points in VvV. The artifacts are antique and don't last very long in medium combat, but can make it easier on new and returning players starting with nothing. 

    I'd imagine it's close to, if not well over, 100m in items with HIGHER stats that we being HANDED out. Mind you these artifacts are even more powerful than what is obtainable in the real artifacts that arguably take hours of game play to get. Who cares they're antique when you can leave and re-join VvV and get brand new 255/255 durability ones for free?
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  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,033
    This is the same problem that the old system had and within 1 week of VvV going live people were sitting in Luna with them on.  This is what the minority player base wants so UO gives it to them just like all these other "FIXES" that bleeds over to PvM and never gets fixed.
  • UrgeUrge Posts: 590
    username said:
    King_Greg said:
    I am an advocate for the artifacts and the free 2k points in VvV. The artifacts are antique and don't last very long in medium combat, but can make it easier on new and returning players starting with nothing. 

    I'd imagine it's close to, if not well over, 100m in items with HIGHER stats that we being HANDED out. Mind you these artifacts are even more powerful than what is obtainable in the real artifacts that arguably take hours of game play to get. Who cares they're antique when you can leave and re-join VvV and get brand new 255/255 durability ones for free?


    When you rejoin you only get 500 points so there is a little drawback. But for the most part I do agree.

    I think VvV artifacts should be left alone while legacy artifacts receive an updated makeover to remotely resemble the quality of loot available.

  • usernameusername Posts: 97
    edited August 2019
    Really need to revisit this. VvV artifacts are being highly abused. There's no incentive to get the real artifact when you can just cycle and get them for free with BETTER stats.

    I would suggest one more easy change @Mesanna ; @Bleak @Kyronix

    VvV artifacts either cannot be equipped in Trammel or provide no stats in Trammel. 
    Again, they devalue content considerably. If that's the goal, why not just hand out all artifacts for free while we're at it?

    Please consider.
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  • Nothing wrong with VvV items, its no different then someone collecting blackthorn arties to avoid having to do ML content.  Do not touch VvV items they are fine.
  • SmootSmoot Posts: 263
    King_Greg said:
    I don't think you can get any of the Deco or Royal pardons for 2k. The supernovas for Sure I could see being an issue, but I am an advocate for the artifacts and the free 2k points in VvV. The artifacts are antique and don't last very long in medium combat, but can make it easier on new and returning players starting with nothing. 

    ive been using mine 4-5 years. 

    unless spawing or farming every single day they basically last forever.
  • SmootSmoot Posts: 263
    edited August 2019
    considering the drop rate on the normal items, yes they are too powerful and should be removed or changed.

    if crimsons were meant to be like a worthless, dropped every single time, maybe multiple times per boss id be ok with the vvv versions.  Whats the point of doing dreadhorn, shimmering effusion, etc if i can get a better version of the item for free?

    as it is now, the vvv artifacts eliminate the need to do game content.

    Now many might say "but pvp is game content and it lets players get in the game faster".  Yes, i agree with that.  But pvp is only available in Fel.

    Simple fix - make vvv arties fall off and not be equipable in tram.
  • SmootSmoot Posts: 263
    edited August 2019
    another fix would be to make the regular versions better than the VVV versions.  Right now tho its basically the opposite of what it should rationally be. 

    The faction versions were created at a time when gearing was much harder, and about 10 times more expensive if you consider inflation.  so there was more of a need for a little stat boost.

    now with legendaries, and abundance of cheap, easy to get arties from cleanup points, crafting, doom revamp, crafting etc thats far from the case any more.  the faction / vvv stats have outworn their purpose.

    Except on Siege, where its still hard to gear.  and its the only shard where you cant get them.  again, the opposite of what you would rationally think would be the case.
  • usernameusername Posts: 97
    edited August 2019
    Nothing wrong with VvV items, its no different then someone collecting blackthorn arties to avoid having to do ML content.  Do not touch VvV items they are fine.
    What? If it's no different, show me where I can join a guild and get free blackthorn artifacts with better stats than the original artifacts for free in 1 minute. LOL!

    I think what you meant is it's completely different ;) content is not equal to getting something for free.

    Done.
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  • What will be next? I know somebody  who owns a house on felucca but didn't participate in pvp.There are bigger problems than getting something for free.

    God great we are a few hundreds of people and still bashing each other.


  • usernameusername Posts: 97
    edited August 2019
    What will be next? I know somebody  who owns a house on felucca but didn't participate in pvp.There are bigger problems than getting something for free.

    God great we are a few hundreds of people and still bashing each other.


    I posted my position, gave several reasons why they should be changed/what's wrong with them and gave very simple examples on how to fix the problem. I'm sorry, but your argument (or lack of?) without any evidence or support does not change my mind. 

    Next.
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  • So someone does pvm in trammel with a vvv crimson on and gains the entire 5 free dex.  OMG such gamebreaking materials.   LOL  come on now, give me a break.
  • Ah and by the way people don't do the content because unless its updated the loot is complete garbage.  Are you gonna run 500 Mel's just for a shot at a crimson or glacial dye and nothing else?!?!
  • usernameusername Posts: 97
    LOL, the entitled millennial attitude, "Cant be bothered to do the game content so just give me it for free now."

    K
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  •   OMG such gamebreaking materials.   LOL  come on now, give me a break.
    Basically your PvP posts in a nutshell.  Nailed it.
  • MariahMariah Posts: 1,216Moderator
    Please keep this thread on topic and not attacking each other
    Thank you.
  • So I post valid points and get attacked by the OP and someone else.   How about those attack posts get deleted.
  • Ah and by the way people don't do the content because unless its updated the loot is complete garbage.  Are you gonna run 500 Mel's just for a shot at a crimson or glacial dye and nothing else?!?!
    Isn't that what you used to run Lady M for before crimsons were made worthless thanks to VvV?

    I sure know I never ran them looking for loot.
  • TyrathTyrath Posts: 240
     I did this on a new character on a new shard to see how worthwhile it was. Everything was broken within a week. At best it gives some good gear to get 3-7 days of training in.  Yep this is totally wrecking PvP and UO as a whole LOL.
  • SmootSmoot Posts: 263
    edited August 2019
    Tyrath said:
     I did this on a new character on a new shard to see how worthwhile it was. Everything was broken within a week. At best it gives some good gear to get 3-7 days of training in.  Yep this is totally wrecking PvP and UO as a whole LOL.

    ive used vvv items alot on pvm characters, and cant see how it would only last a week unless taking damage or using a skill 24/7

    theres many factors that go into how long it lasts, but for pvm, after years of using the stuff ive calculated that for my sampire at least the stuff will last about 300 hours play time if properly repaired.  Thats pvm, "in combat" often, but not 100 percent of the time like if you were training skills.  for pvp it basically lasts forever since most pvp battles are brief compared to login time.

    thats more than enough time for me and for the average player to have no reason to use the real, less powerful versions. 
  • VladimirVladimir Posts: 29
    I have EM event toons on all shards, using VVV headress and crimson, been over 2 years since i created them and they still using the 1 of 2 on each one.
    You go to event , you attack boss, take dmg and after 3 or 4 events, you repair.
    This vvv equipments, if you know how to really play the game, will last forever.
  • usernameusername Posts: 97
    Vladimir said:
    I have EM event toons on all shards, using VVV headress and crimson, been over 2 years since i created them and they still using the 1 of 2 on each one.
    You go to event , you attack boss, take dmg and after 3 or 4 events, you repair.
    This vvv equipments, if you know how to really play the game, will last forever.
    Thank you for your input and being honest. You are dead correct that these artifacts can and will last forever... and that's really the problem with them.
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  • CookieCookie Posts: 522
    edited September 2019
    username said:
    Vladimir said:
    I have EM event toons on all shards, using VVV headress and crimson, been over 2 years since i created them and they still using the 1 of 2 on each one.
    You go to event , you attack boss, take dmg and after 3 or 4 events, you repair.
    This vvv equipments, if you know how to really play the game, will last forever.
    Thank you for your input and being honest. You are dead correct that these artifacts can and will last forever... and that's really the problem with them.


    I play in Felucca, PvP and VvV.

    I don't VvV for these rewards, the Antique tag makes them useless, they burn down in seconds.

    I will not wear any VvV items, they need a buff, and definitely getting rid of the Antique tag.

    I don't think any actual player would use VvV items - notice the above example, the player only plays EM events... When he talks about really playing the game, he means Banksitting.

    So whilst I disagree that VvV items are any use to the actual guys who want to use them, I can see maybe they are abused.

    Ban them from Trammel? Fine.



  • usernameusername Posts: 97
    edited September 2019
    Cookie said:

    I play in Felucca, PvP and VvV.

    I don't VvV for these rewards, the Antique tag makes them useless, they burn down in seconds.

    I will not wear any VvV items, they need a buff, and definitely getting rid of the Antique tag.

    I don't think any actual player would use VvV items - notice the above example, the player only plays EM events... When he talks about really playing the game, he means Banksitting.

    So whilst I disagree that VvV items are any use to the actual guys who want to use them, I can see maybe they are abused.

    Ban them from Trammel? Fine.



    They are already better than their original artifact counterparts. No buff lol. If you play in Felucca, PVP and VvV then you are using the artifacts for their intended purpose and you will have no problem purchasing replacements when they wear out.

    Zero stats for VVV gear in trammel would be an excellent fix @Kyronix ;

    Especially with the destruction of Blackthorns artifacts it would be a great way to encourage people to actually do the content
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  • CookieCookie Posts: 522
    edited September 2019
    username said:
    Cookie said:

    I play in Felucca, PvP and VvV.

    I don't VvV for these rewards, the Antique tag makes them useless, they burn down in seconds.

    I will not wear any VvV items, they need a buff, and definitely getting rid of the Antique tag.

    I don't think any actual player would use VvV items - notice the above example, the player only plays EM events... When he talks about really playing the game, he means Banksitting.

    So whilst I disagree that VvV items are any use to the actual guys who want to use them, I can see maybe they are abused.

    Ban them from Trammel? Fine.



    They are already better than their original artifact counterparts. No buff lol. If you play in Felucca, PVP and VvV then you are using the artifacts for their intended purpose and you will have no problem purchasing replacements when they wear out.

    Zero stats for VVV gear in trammel would be an excellent fix @ Mesanna @ @ Kyronix 

    Especially with the destruction of Blackthorns artifacts it would be a great way to encourage people to actually do the content


    I've already stated I PvP, VvV and will not use the items. I don't care if you think they are better because they have better stats. They wear down too fast, and I actually want to play the game, ie PvP, rather than keep worrying about the state of my gear all the time.

    So the items are pointless, for the players who would actually want to earn them and use them for the right reasons.

    I've just made another thread, where I mention my IDOC PvP for around 4 hours in total nonstop last night. It was intense, at no point during that, do I want to be thinking about my gear. That was just 1 fight... I fight all the time.

    But to agree with you on this thread topic, though maybe for completely different reasons - ban them from Trammel, to stop other types of abuse you mention - sure.

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