Delete the PvM flag logout timer

Feigr

Merus said:

I confirmed tonight on CC…

I recalled home and a rat about a half screen away targeted me.  I stepped up onto my house a couple tiles in full view of the rat then logged off.  I was able to immediately log in another character on my porch who was immediately targeted by the rat… I then logged that character and was able to immediately log back in on the original character.

Let it reach you instead.  This isn't a complicated thing.  

Merus

Feigr said:

Merus said:

I confirmed tonight on CC…

I recalled home and a rat about a half screen away targeted me.  I stepped up onto my house a couple tiles in full view of the rat then logged off.  I was able to immediately log in another character on my porch who was immediately targeted by the rat… I then logged that character and was able to immediately log back in on the original character.

Let it reach you instead.  This isn't a complicated thing.  

Ok, I did that.  Let it hit me and it did 1 point of damage.  I then stepped up on the house and got exactly the same results as before.

Pawain

Yup you have to hit or attempt to hit the mob.  As some have been saying.  If all it took was the mob targeting you, you would never be able to log off in our houses.

Merus lives in the same area as I on a different server.

Feigr

Pawain said:

Yup you have to hit or attempt to hit the mob.  As some have been saying.  If all it took was the mob targeting you, you would never be able to log off in our houses.

Merus lives in the same area as I on a different server.

My character automatically hits back.  And even if there is a setting I didn't see on a short look, I wouldn't want to turn that off.

Merus

Feigr said:

Pawain said:

Yup you have to hit or attempt to hit the mob.  As some have been saying.  If all it took was the mob targeting you, you would never be able to log off in our houses.

Merus lives in the same area as I on a different server.

My character automatically hits back.  And even if there is a setting I didn't see on a short look, I wouldn't want to turn that off.

So you’ve now confirmed what everyone has been saying in this thread… the timer only kicks in if you attack the mob, even in self defense (auto-defend).

I would say this is working as intended to prevent players abusing the ability to log out mid fight with no delay.  While I do agree that the overall impact of changing this kind of rule related to PvM is what I would consider minor, it is nonetheless the intended function of the timer.

Feigr

Merus said:

Feigr said:

Pawain said:

Yup you have to hit or attempt to hit the mob.  As some have been saying.  If all it took was the mob targeting you, you would never be able to log off in our houses.

Merus lives in the same area as I on a different server.

My character automatically hits back.  And even if there is a setting I didn't see on a short look, I wouldn't want to turn that off.

So you’ve now confirmed what everyone has been saying in this thread… the timer only kicks in if you attack the mob, even in self defense (auto-defend).

I would say this is working as intended to prevent players abusing the ability to log out mid fight with no delay.  While I do agree that the overall impact of changing this kind of rule related to PvM is what I would consider minor, it is nonetheless the intended function of the timer.

What abuse though? Removing it would make QoL so much better.  You're fighting in a spawn and someone asks for something you can do on another character... Just recall back to house and swap.  What's the abuse there?

Merus

Feigr said:

Merus said:

Feigr said:

Pawain said:

Yup you have to hit or attempt to hit the mob.  As some have been saying.  If all it took was the mob targeting you, you would never be able to log off in our houses.

Merus lives in the same area as I on a different server.

My character automatically hits back.  And even if there is a setting I didn't see on a short look, I wouldn't want to turn that off.

So you’ve now confirmed what everyone has been saying in this thread… the timer only kicks in if you attack the mob, even in self defense (auto-defend).

I would say this is working as intended to prevent players abusing the ability to log out mid fight with no delay.  While I do agree that the overall impact of changing this kind of rule related to PvM is what I would consider minor, it is nonetheless the intended function of the timer.

What abuse though? Removing it would make QoL so much better.  You're fighting in a spawn and someone asks for something you can do on another character... Just recall back to house and swap.  What's the abuse there?

Just because you can’t imagine a scenario where it could be abused doesn’t mean there isn’t one.

For example:

I popped a Harry Sunday morning to kill it solo.  I got lucky and it was in Destard.  I lured him right to the exit for what would hopefully be a quick exit if I got raided.  It was a quiet morning and no one bothered me… under a rule set where monster combat has no timer I could step out if I got raided right before Harry dies and instantly log to get a PvP character.  IMO, that would be abuse of the intended delay for switching characters.

Feigr

People have already said not with the Heat of Battle debuff.  That would be the exception. You can't just teleport out with it either.

Wanna go test that part?

Merus

Feigr said:

People have already said not with the Heat of Battle debuff.  That would be the exception. You can't just teleport out with it either.

Wanna go test that part?

Who said it requires heat of battle?  My sampire fighting Harry… a red runs in… before they flag me, I run out and recall… instantly switch characters and come back on my PvP character.

Feigr

Oh, then I don't see the abuse there.  You got away.  Good for you.

Lord_Frodo

Merus said:

I confirmed tonight on CC…

I recalled home and a rat about a half screen away targeted me.  I stepped up onto my house a couple tiles in full view of the rat then logged off.  I was able to immediately log in another character on my porch who was immediately targeted by the rat… I then logged that character and was able to immediately log back in on the original character.

So the rat never hit you did it.

Pawain

Lord_Frodo said:

Merus said:

I confirmed tonight on CC…

I recalled home and a rat about a half screen away targeted me.  I stepped up onto my house a couple tiles in full view of the rat then logged off.  I was able to immediately log in another character on my porch who was immediately targeted by the rat… I then logged that character and was able to immediately log back in on the original character.

So the rat never hit you did it.

It is irrelevant if the rat hit him.  If his toon does not hit or attempt to hit the rat, there will be no log in delay.  I told you, I get hit by gargoyles or Reapers now and can log off and change toons immediately.

Feigr

The distinction of hitting or not hitting is moot.  It shouldn't matter if you hit them anyways.  That's the small request.

Pawain

They are not going to remove the timer. It was made for a reason and the reason is still present.

It will most likely be part of NL.

Feigr

I'm good with that being your argument.  I've stated my case as well as I can.  Maybe the devs will come to the same conclusion as me if they are looking for some minor QoL change... Maybe they'll agree with you.  I don't know what that "reason" is personally.  I don't think the threat of scripters should keep non-scripters sitting twiddling thumbs waiting to swap characters.  Scripters are going to script anyways.  I don't think rolling a human for every character or fitting in some camping skill on templates on characters is another solution either.

It's all minor to me.  Would be nice to jump to your house and swap characters as needed from your home only and if you're not Heat of Battled.  

Yoshi

“I don’t think heat of battle (de)buff works well, I’ll create a full bug report later but it’s a side issue, v low priority.

@Feigr how would it be a QoL change? removing the timer will decrease the game quality…

it would be so dumb to sampire a boss down to 40% hp then be able to insta switch char to word of death char

It’s bad enough when people swap clothes insta to luck suit. Luck should be a factor for all monster hp not at death but that is separate issue”

LilyGrace

The light dawns…

My apologies, Yoshi. I get it now. I don’t think I realized that I was auto-defending even when trying to fly by without striking. And I didn’t consider the potential exploitation of insta-logging. 

Thanks for the info. 

Seth

Yall mean there are no better solutions to an exploit than to have 2mins cooldown when my crafter happens to walk pass a mongbat on the way home?

It's not as if everyone is slaying a boss every day and minute. There are so many things going on.

Yoshi

"Seth, just take a wide birth, don't hit the mongbat

or mark your runes on your doorstep

"

Merlin

Just going to put this here again... regardless of the font-size shamers...

NOT BROKE.

DON'T FIX. 

That is the only argument that is needed here.  The arguments for making a drastic change here are pretty poor and rather self-centered.  

You guys complain to the high heavens about the developer's making changes and screwing up something else in the process.  Perhaps the 25 year-old login timer mechanic is something that doesn't need to be adjusted because some impatient players can't be inconvenienced to wait 2 minutes.   Want to log on another character quickly?  Get another account or train up Camping.  Avoid that pesky Mongbat that hangs near your house.  There are options around this. 

Feigr

Not all things have to be bug fixes.  Some are just QoL things.  But yea, enjoy this games rising success and popularity.  Keep doing what you're doing and listening to people that use large fonts.

McDougle

Merlin said:

Just going to put this here again... regardless of the font-size shamers...

NOT BROKE.

DON'T FIX. 

That is the only argument that is needed here.  The arguments for making a drastic change here are pretty poor and rather self-centered.  

You guys complain to the high heavens about the developer's making changes and screwing up something else in the process.  Perhaps the 25 year-old login timer mechanic is something that doesn't need to be adjusted because some impatient players can't be inconvenienced to wait 2 minutes.   Want to log on another character quickly?  Get another account or train up Camping.  Avoid that pesky Mongbat that hangs near your house.  There are options around this. 

It's not the annoying 2minute timer it's the fact that you're still in game for 2 minutes after you log out

Theo

The flag should be reset when you recall or use a moongate.  You've left the area of battle. There is no sense in not allowing someone to log out.   I get attacked by a mongbat. I kill said mongbat. I recall home.  I am in a timeout until my next toon. That makes no sense whatsoever.  Once you leave the area with recall or moongate the timer should end.  Code it. 

Rorschach

Some posts not related to the topic of this thread have been removed.

Yoshi

Theo said:

The flag should be reset when you recall or use a moongate.  You've left the area of battle. There is no sense in not allowing someone to log out.   I get attacked by a mongbat. I kill said mongbat. I recall home.  I am in a timeout until my next toon. That makes no sense whatsoever.  Once you leave the area with recall or moongate the timer should end.  Code it. 

"so you can sampire a boss down to 40%, recall to house, switch to weaver and recall back in?"

McDougle

Yoshi said:

Theo said:

The flag should be reset when you recall or use a moongate.  You've left the area of battle. There is no sense in not allowing someone to log out.   I get attacked by a mongbat. I kill said mongbat. I recall home.  I am in a timeout until my next toon. That makes no sense whatsoever.  Once you leave the area with recall or moongate the timer should end.  Code it. 

"so you can sampire a boss down to 40%, recall to house, switch to weaver and recall back in?"

No boss worth doing would allow this

Seth

Any boss worth doing won't allow that fast recall back and then WOD the boss at Gauntlet, Shadowguard, Mondain Legacy, Corgul, Underwater (long run), etc.

For the rest, my sampire pride to be able to finish a boss than to waste time recalling back home. But if I am determined to do so, 2 minutes isn't enough to stop me. 

Re. walking around the mongbat? It's like telling us to go around the problem instead of solving it.

Seth

The logout timer is not a bug.

It's a problem that is felt by a significant group of players.

The solution does not have to be removal of timer but replaced or tweaked so that others don't suffer limitations because of the few.

McDougle

Seth said:

The logout timer is not a bug.

It's a problem that is felt by a significant group of players.

The solution does not have to be removal of timer but replaced or tweaked so that others don't suffer limitations because of the few.

Its a pvp problem that affects pvm players why heat of battle was not written in the initial code baffles me but surely adding it shouldn't be difficult 

Seth

Just going to put this here again... regardless of the font-size shamers...

NOT BROKE.

DON'T FIX. 

That is the only argument that is needed here.  The arguments for making a drastic change here are pretty poor and rather self-centered.  

You guys complain to the high heavens about the developer's making changes and screwing up something else in the process.  Perhaps the 25 year-old login timer mechanic is something that doesn't need to be adjusted because some impatient players can't be inconvenienced to wait 2 minutes.   Want to log on another character quickly?  Get another account or train up Camping.  Avoid that pesky Mongbat that hangs near your house.  There are options around this. 

As some said,  this is not game breaking but am irritation for the majority that is not exploiting it. Sure we can use camping but please add max skill points to 840. But why should we use an ingame skill to solve a game system design issue?

About dev making changes and adding more bugs, yes. They make changes that does not improve game play that affects majority of players. Instead of solving the teething problems and bugs that players felt first hand.

And anyway they will always need to make changes like this dynamic event. So is the solution not to change or have new events? No, the problem is the QC.

Edit:
Having said these, the issue is still not an urgent bug that needs "fixing". I merely vote that this is a irritation for me.