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could someone provide a guide to the player wiki maybe?

Max_BlackoakMax_Blackoak Posts: 648
in General Discussions
I am currently helping two brand new players who have never ever played UO before and just started 2 weeks ago.
Needless to say everything is insanely confusing to them and they have a really hard time understanding what to do and how to do things.
The other day they told me they were tired of killing ettins and they wanted to move on to demons. Now I told them to search the wiki to find out where demons spawn...then I tried doing that myself...nothing.
Same result with other things I would have expected to be able to find there.
I then told them to use uoguide, despite the fact that it has somewhat dated info. Over there all you have to do is type demon in the search bar and you get to a page about demons, where they spawn etc.
Would be nice to have the wiki produce similar results with just as little effort. Maybe I'm doing something wrong though?

Comments

  • XareXare Posts: 124
    Thank you for taking the time to introduce new players as to why they should never play UO. 
  • SlissSliss Posts: 283
    Xare said:
    Thank you for taking the time to introduce new players as to why they should never play UO. 
    Because the wiki does not tell them where Demons spawn?
  • Ezekiel_ZaneEzekiel_Zane Posts: 326
    http://www.uoguide.com/Daemon


    Hook them up with the uo.wiki, uoguide.com and of course the Stratics Hunter's Guide

    https://uo.stratics.com/database/view.php?db_content=hunters&id=375
  • XareXare Posts: 124
    Sliss said:
    Xare said:
    Thank you for taking the time to introduce new players as to why they should never play UO. 
    Because the wiki does not tell them where Demons spawn?
    Because everything they think they should be able to do, they can't. 
  • Max_BlackoakMax_Blackoak Posts: 648
    Ezekiel_Zane said:
    http://www.uoguide.com/Daemon


    Hook them up with the uo.wiki, uoguide.com and of course the Stratics Hunter's Guide

    https://uo.stratics.com/database/view.php?db_content=hunters&id=375
    I did but my point is the official uo wiki is so cumbersome to navigate and doesn't seem to provide a simple search function where you can search for specific content.
  • MissEMissE Posts: 782
    You have to KNOW what you are looking for on the UOwiki.  If you don't  it is as Max says nearly impossible to find things.  You only have to go to the directory of BOTH uowiki and uoguide to see the difference.

    As a vet, using uowiki, I find it is quicker to google exactly what you want then select the uowiki from any link you get there. I NEVER use their directory as it takes forever to find what you want IF you can actually find it.  Sadly though newbies don't actually know the thing to search for as old timers do.  

    Just go and do a simple search on both sites on the word 'Dragon' or 'lower reagent cost' and see what you get.




    Cheers MissE

    For more info about Angelwood Warehouse Events go to the A.W.E Forum
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    edited March 2019
    I also agree there is definitely something wrong with the uo wiki search. (For a start the search bar is not on every page)

    even when I know a page exists I struggle to find it. 

    I also agree with MissE that googling a term has a better hit result for the wiki.

    As an example I just tried “blood oath”
    the page I wanted 
    https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/skills/necromancy/
    was the last result the wiki search presented me. 

    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • UrgeUrge Posts: 1,276

    I've used this for years to find things to do.

    https://uo.stratics.com/hunters/


  • MariahMariah Posts: 3,245Moderator
    edited March 2019
    I'm sorry you find the wiki difficult to navigate. I am usually able to find what I want using the search function, but then I have an advantage.

    I did create this section to help new players: https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/beginning-the-adventure/
    That link does feature on the wiki's front page. Within that section you will also find this link:

    I find it useful to exclude publish notes from searches, as there are rather a lot of them and they can obscure the result you want. Do this by adding -publish to your search criteria (note no space between the - and the word publish).


  • JollyJadeJollyJade Posts: 578
    edited March 2019
    I am currently helping two brand new players who have never ever played UO before and just started 2 weeks ago.
    Needless to say everything is insanely confusing to them and they have a really hard time understanding what to do and how to do things.
    The other day they told me they were tired of killing ettins and they wanted to move on to demons. Now I told them to search the wiki to find out where demons spawn...then I tried doing that myself...nothing.
    Same result with other things I would have expected to be able to find there.
    I then told them to use uoguide, despite the fact that it has somewhat dated info. Over there all you have to do is type demon in the search bar and you get to a page about demons, where they spawn etc.
    Would be nice to have the wiki produce similar results with just as little effort. Maybe I'm doing something wrong though?
    I don't understand why they had to split the community even further by introducing another wiki and not even adding the basics. Though when you tell the editors will only tell everything is fine and it's the users fault.
    I checked those sites Mariah linked. Apparently a new player's first wishes are to know 1000 spoken NPC commands and how to log out. The novice adventuring starts with the beginner quest that was just cut out with EJ. And then goes with walls and walls of text.
    On uoguide you could at least correct outdated and wrong things, but here you got to beg an editor for it. Not worth it. They will figure sooner or later.
    Just a troll who got told by lesser trolls (moderator classification)
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    JollyJade said:
    On uoguide you could at least correct outdated and wrong things, 
    Why the past tense? you can still update uoguide.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • SlissSliss Posts: 283
    JollyJade said:
    I don't understand why they had to split the community even further by introducing another wiki and not even adding the basics. 
    Well, that's easy. They did not control the content of UOGuide.
  • JollyJadeJollyJade Posts: 578
    Sliss said:
    JollyJade said:
    I don't understand why they had to split the community even further by introducing another wiki and not even adding the basics. 
    Well, that's easy. They did not control the content of UOGuide.
    An ego thing.. ok. They have no problem contracting gold sellers for various tasks but are scared to reach out to someone running the most comprehesive and free wiki for them...

    OTOH we see what "being in control" means. Having to point every mistake out to @Mariah and hope for the best. Sure nobody got better things to do with his time.
    Just a troll who got told by lesser trolls (moderator classification)
  • TimTim Posts: 826
    edited March 2019
    In this content "Control" means content is vetted by the developers as Correct and contains no exploits or outright cheats. So not "ego" more a mater of legal responsibility and perception. After all would you start playing a game if told by the developer go to this 3rd party site for all you information  you need oh and by the way we don't guarantee it is correct.

    PS I like the idea of two sites the info is not always the same.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    The more sites the better for the player base.  This is the only site that is vetted by the MODs and DEVs the other are vetted by players and we would hope that it is correct.  All of @Petra_Fyde site was brought here and it was easier to use than this site is at times.  It is getting better.
  • TanagerTanager Posts: 634
    Just my 2 cents...

    First: It is professional for UO to have its own official forum, and its own official wiki and information pages. UO is a small game filling a small niche in the MMO world, and has a small team of developers and helpers. The wiki is constantly being expanded, but it is not perfect. I have taken to using Google's search, which will also look for the correct spelling of what I am searching for. Google generally puts pages with more views at the top. Since other pages have been around longer, they have accumulated more views and tend to get more views first.

    Second: Multiple sites is healthy and good for the community. EJ and people who no longer have active accounts but are still interested in UO can use those sites, for one thing. We can chatter all we want across several other forums, but if anything wants to reach the Devs ears it pretty much needs to be said here. Choosing ONE site to focus on allows them more time to work on Sosaria.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    Well put @Tanager
  • XareXare Posts: 124
    edited March 2019
    Mariah said:
    I'm sorry you find the wiki difficult to navigate. I am usually able to find what I want using the search function, but then I have an advantage.

    I did create this section to help new players: https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/beginning-the-adventure/
    That link does feature on the wiki's front page. Within that section you will also find this link:

    I find it useful to exclude publish notes from searches, as there are rather a lot of them and they can obscure the result you want. Do this by adding -publish to your search criteria (note no space between the - and the word publish).



    @Mariah , I appreciate everything you've done on the wiki, the amount of time and effort spent on it is noticeable.  My main critique with it is how difficult and not user friendly it is to search.  I agree that if you know exactly what you're looking for, its findable, however, that's not always the case.

    Example:
    I randomly went looking for lower mana cost.  User would expect a page on lower mana cost, saying what it does, what the cap is, and maybe a listing of artifacts with it.  Top five hits:
    • Artifacts & Equipment - Vice versus Virtue
    • Deluxe Starter Pack
    • Publish 99
    • Armor Choice
    • Publish 96
    I was finally able to find a detailed description of LMC after guessing that maybe the Loot Generation page (on the 2nd page of results) might have a link, which it does indeed have a link to the item properties page, which details what it does, its cap, and what pieces of gear it can be on.

    Since this thread is comparing to uoguide.com, let's do a similar search there:


    As for removing publish notes from searches, I don't see the option to do that.

    Overall, I like what the wiki here has, just finding information is not always simple as it could be.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,026
    As has been mentioned.  If I do not have the topic bookmarked, I open google and type UO Demons.  It takes you right to a page that can answer the question.  UO has taken over the internet!
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
  • XareXare Posts: 124
    edited March 2019
    Pawain said:
    As has been mentioned.  If I do not have the topic bookmarked, I open google and type UO Demons.  It takes you right to a page that can answer the question.  UO has taken over the internet!
    Yes, thank you, your advice has been enlightening! 


    huh, none of those are the UO wiki for item properties or lower mana cost.  But that uoguides one is the top hit!  Win!!


    Are we done posting just to post @Pawain?  Maybe post something a little bit constructive or nothing?
  • Victim_Of_SiegeVictim_Of_Siege Posts: 2,102
    edited March 2019
    Xare said:
    Pawain said:
    As has been mentioned.  If I do not have the topic bookmarked, I open google and type UO Demons.  It takes you right to a page that can answer the question.  UO has taken over the internet!
    Yes, thank you, your advice has been enlightening! 


    huh, none of those are the UO wiki for item properties or lower mana cost.  But that uoguides one is the top hit!  Win!!


    Are we done posting just to post @ Pawain?  Maybe post something a little bit constructive or nothing?


    Perhaps it is because the other sites have been around longer, but the site does come up on searches in google.
    A Goblin, a Gargoyle, and a Drow walk into a bar . . .

    Never be afraid to challenge the status quo

  • XareXare Posts: 124
    Guess it depends on the topic. Like I said, it was a random query. 
  • MissEMissE Posts: 782
    The UO wiki is much better ONCE you find the item you are looking for.  My beef is with the search function of it too.  Hence why I put the directories of both wikis to show the difference.  It is the directory that needs fixing then the actual search function itself.  Yes, google works if you know what  you are looking for but if you don't the UO wiki directory is NOT user friendly.

    Cheers MissE

    For more info about Angelwood Warehouse Events go to the A.W.E Forum
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    edited March 2019
    Actually each person’s google result is specific to them. It’s 1984 already.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • Victim_Of_SiegeVictim_Of_Siege Posts: 2,102
    Mervyn said:
    Actually each person’s google result is specific to them. It’s 1984 already.
    Great book, great year. 
    A Goblin, a Gargoyle, and a Drow walk into a bar . . .

    Never be afraid to challenge the status quo

  • PawainPawain Posts: 10,026
    edited March 2019
    Xare said:
    Pawain said:
    As has been mentioned.  If I do not have the topic bookmarked, I open google and type UO Demons.  It takes you right to a page that can answer the question.  UO has taken over the internet!
    Yes, thank you, your advice has been enlightening! 


    huh, none of those are the UO wiki for item properties or lower mana cost.  But that uoguides one is the top hit!  Win!!


    Are we done posting just to post @ Pawain?  Maybe post something a little bit constructive or nothing?

    Im sorry we have entered an age where you can find the answers on Google.  If the UO wiki wants hits then they will make better guides that can be found.   We are in the computer age and if UO cant get hits then they need to advance.

    This is the correct place to tell them that the UO wiki is inadequate.

    I use the resource that Google sends me to and I see an Ad.  UO and Ads Rule the internet!

    Post Count +1
    Focus on what you can do, not what you can't.
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