Why Are Paying Customers Being Silenced on Critical Topics?

Mariah · May 26

In an effort to not further exasperate NikonUS I will not close this topic, instead I will delete the entire side topic started by King. I apologize to those posters who spoke in opposition to King's ToS breaking proposal.

Seth · May 26

Mariah said:

In an effort to not further exasperate NikonUS I will not close this topic, instead I will delete the entire side topic started by King. I apologize to those posters who spoke in opposition to King's ToS breaking proposal.

I don’t think there’s any need to apologize for removing off-topic posts that break the Terms of Service. Consistent action like this sets the right tone — it encourages constructive discussion, discourages feeding trolls, and reminds us to use the report button instead.

That said, I do hope the Dev team can be more present to help address concerns or at least provide closure where needed.

Oreogl · May 26

Kyronix said:

Your feedback has been shared with the team as noted. We will discuss the issue internally and if we feel changes are warranted we will make them known when they get through development. Regardless - anything housing related requires engineering support and those resources are dedicated to the classic client upgrade which is slated for a mid-summer test version.

Thanks for taking the time to respond. I haven’t been around as much since it’s rolling into summer, but are there any previews for the classic client update?

Is this going to primarily be a functionality update or going to include some graphics upgrades as well?

If this has already been addressed please disregard, someone will point me in the right direction I’m sure.

Thanks again.

Jepeth · May 26

Oreogl said:

Kyronix said:

Your feedback has been shared with the team as noted. We will discuss the issue internally and if we feel changes are warranted we will make them known when they get through development. Regardless - anything housing related requires engineering support and those resources are dedicated to the classic client upgrade which is slated for a mid-summer test version.

Thanks for taking the time to respond. I haven’t been around as much since it’s rolling into summer, but are there any previews for the classic client update?

Is this going to primarily be a functionality update or going to include some graphics upgrades as well?

If this has already been addressed please disregard, someone will point me in the right direction I’m sure.

Thanks again.

Patrick asked Kyronix this in their interview this past week. The long and short of it, all though I’d encourage everyone to listen to the whole thing, is that the major work so far has been on the back end getting the CC to the point they can make any changes at all with up to date code libraries. After that they’re looking at mid summer tests for more frame rate and expandable play window. More qol will come later.

Oreogl · May 27

Jepeth said:

Oreogl said:

Kyronix said:

Your feedback has been shared with the team as noted. We will discuss the issue internally and if we feel changes are warranted we will make them known when they get through development. Regardless - anything housing related requires engineering support and those resources are dedicated to the classic client upgrade which is slated for a mid-summer test version.

Thanks for taking the time to respond. I haven’t been around as much since it’s rolling into summer, but are there any previews for the classic client update?

Is this going to primarily be a functionality update or going to include some graphics upgrades as well?

If this has already been addressed please disregard, someone will point me in the right direction I’m sure.

Thanks again.

Patrick asked Kyronix this in their interview this past week. The long and short of it, all though I’d encourage everyone to listen to the whole thing, is that the major work so far has been on the back end getting the CC to the point they can make any changes at all with up to date code libraries. After that they’re looking at mid summer tests for more frame rate and expandable play window. More qol will come later.

Thanks for this. Time has been a hard commodity to come by lately. I appreciate any help I can get. Have a good one!

steven · June 4

its easy. there friends can do want ever then want. u do 1% of that and get ban. easy as that. u don't like it go play a new game then think. the pop of uo is so low less then 15k real players. Rember this game had 1 million players before. then killed it . then let there friends run the game in the ground.

Lokea · June 4

steven said:

. the pop of uo is so low less then 15k real players. Rember this game had 1 million players before. then killed it .

I doubt it's as low as 15,000, otherwise there would be a lot more large (keep/castle) spots open on more shards, and a lot more Luna spots open.

And UO never got close to 1 million (although there's been over a million accounts opened and closed since 1997). The peak was 250,000 in July of 2003, and that was an average of about 9,000 players per production shard, but the reality is that shards like Atlantic, LS, GL, etc. had more than 9,000 players, while smaller shards had 5,000-7,000).

Those of us playing back then would have definitely felt it if we had a million players, and there'd be a helluva lot more than 27 production shards.

If we only had 15,000 players, Atlantic would not be nearly as busy as it is and there'd be more housing spots, because almost all keep/castle spots are taken on all other shards, as are most Luna houses, etc.

Grimbeard · June 4

Lokea said:

steven said:

. the pop of uo is so low less then 15k real players. Rember this game had 1 million players before. then killed it .

I doubt it's as low as 15,000, otherwise there would be a lot more large (keep/castle) spots open on more shards, and a lot more Luna spots open.

And UO never got close to 1 million (although there's been over a million accounts opened and closed since 1997). The peak was 250,000 in July of 2003, and that was an average of about 9,000 players per production shard, but the reality is that shards like Atlantic, LS, GL, etc. had more than 9,000 players, while smaller shards had 5,000-7,000).

Those of us playing back then would have definitely felt it if we had a million players, and there'd be a helluva lot more than 27 production shards.

If we only had 15,000 players, Atlantic would not be nearly as busy as it is and there'd be more housing spots, because almost all keep/castle spots are taken on all other shards, as are most Luna houses, etc.

I think you grossly underestimate how many people have multiple and I mean MULTIPLE accounts....

Lokea · June 4

Grimbeard said:
I think you grossly underestimate how many people have multiple and I mean MULTIPLE accounts....

True, 15,000 players could mean 30,000 - 45,000 accounts. I do think there are more players than people realize, it’s just many of them are not actively playing, and instead just holding on to their home.

When UO was at its peak of 250,000, I wonder how many actual players that was.

_Psycoder · June 7

Jepeth said:
Patrick asked Kyronix this in their interview this past week. The long and short of it, all though I’d encourage everyone to listen to the whole thing, is that the major work so far has been on the back end getting the CC to the point they can make any changes at all with up to date code libraries. After that they’re looking at mid summer tests for more frame rate and expandable play window. More qol will come later.

I have a feeling I might be eaten alive for this but I do hope the CC changes do not break some of the automation that is available via some other means. At least until all of the QoL changes are in place.

I have a minor disability and I love to play crafters in UO. I once had more than 40+ crafters in the game. Collecting 20+ bods for each crafter, sorting those bods, filling those bods one by one would take me more than 24 hours every day and it would cause me unbelievable physical pain.

@NikonUS the person you are referring to does not use 30 accounts. That is just a rumor. He once found a bug with ethereal mounths and used that for a while until devs fixed it. Then he found another bug with pet summoning balls and used that for a while until the devs fixed it. Remember UO code base is almost 30 years old. The development in UO started before most of the software engineering principles were created. 30+ accounts is just a rumor that he is spreading when he finds a new bug.

I agree that we need a change with the current IDOC placement. But, I just wanted to voice my opinion that breaking some things without putting QoL in place will hurt me and many others.

I agree with @KroDuK on this. I think a bit of automation is ok as long as we are not AFK.

@Kyronix I hope this is taken into consideration with the new CC changes.

@Mariah I hope voicing my opinion does not violate the ToS.

KroDuK · June 7

_Psycoder said:
I agree with @ KroDuK on this. I think a bit of automation is ok as long as we are not AFK.

You just teleport them.. problem solve.. after all we need is a legit shard.. for the good OW PvP.. no wuss automation for 95% of PvP actions.. (hard capping on gear.. bring back 95% of the content with good theorycrafting instead of entire generic set of BIS like we were playing a theme park)

At first on a GM island.. then they will realised 99% are bots.. and teleport them instant in a brit cell for public shaming for the time of their sanction.

Or in the middle of britain.. hand tied to the pillory.. so people can play with the pinata.. dropping pieces of his wealth for the time being.

InLor · June 7

Kyronix said:

Your feedback has been shared with the team as noted. We will discuss the issue internally and if we feel changes are warranted we will make them known when they get through development. Regardless - anything housing related requires engineering support and those resources are dedicated to the classic client upgrade which is slated for a mid-summer test version.

"classic client upgrade"?? Be still, my heart! Where can I read about these upgrades?

__Psycoder · July 12

@NikonUS

I will leave these here:

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/13901/fix-the-mother-f-king-idocs-dammit#latest

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/13960/idoc-monopoly

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/comment/110601/#Comment_110601

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/13946/

I am triggered at this moment, because my account is suspended for playing AFK... I am not even logged into the game. You heard that, right. I got suspended for being AFK when I was not even logged in. But, the first thread about the nonono monopoly on this forum goes back to 3+ years!!! Yeah!!! Literally a single player had IDOC monopoly for 3+ years!!! You heard that right.

On the other hand, this is nonono on the OFFICIAL DISCORD selling IDOCs: https://discord.com/channels/1378606555364069387/1386172961274204282

As you can see, the scripter, who has had monopoly on Atlanic, who was also proven to be using exploits as proven by two other developers, is selling his houses on the official discord. Right in front of the publishers very eyes.

What does the publisher say about this? Lets see...

Image: https://forum.uo.com/uploads/editor/x8/ubysqt2hpg6n.png

At this point, I am 100% sure that nonono can start selling RMT in the official discord, and he will get away with it.

I had been thinking Mesanna was getting kickbacks from nonono. I never thought it was Kyronix... Lol the whole game is just a fraud. No wonder nobody is getting any rare Clydesdale even after dropping 100$ to the totem. Just pay 25$ to nonono he will give you one...

__Psycoder · July 12

BTW, so far they banned 4 of my accounts for bringing up this topic, with receipts, multiple times. I would not be surprised if this account gets banned again because I am bringing up the housing monopoly and the potential kickbacks once more.

keven2002 · July 12

__Psycoder said:

BTW, so far they banned 4 of my accounts for bringing up this topic, with receipts, multiple times. I would not be surprised if this account gets banned again because I am bringing up the housing monopoly and the potential kickbacks once more.

__Psycoder · July 12

keven2002 said:

Lol, there is nothing to be surprised. Look at this. It is an "Ask me anything" Q/A from an ex broadsword employee:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ultimaonline/comments/uoh1w9/ama_former_broadsword_gm_river_em_emile_layne_and/

According to the poster, a Broadsword employee was engaged in RMT, the producer knew about this. They brushed it under the carpet and let it go on for a while... I would not be surprised to hear if nonono was someone from UO development team. This guy literally had housing monopoly for years!

JohnKnighthawke · July 12

A two-page thread is not being "silenced" on anything, especially when it includes accusations of corruption on part of one of the employees.

MsScarlett · July 12

JohnKnighthawke said:

A two-page thread is not being "silenced" on anything, especially when it includes accusations of corruption on part of one of the employees.

well the accusations just are recent.. so lets see how long it takes.

__Psycoder · July 12

JohnKnighthawke said:

A two-page thread is not being "silenced" on anything, especially when it includes accusations of corruption on part of one of the employees.

They silenced the original thread. Let me repeat this for you:

THEY SILENCED THE ORIGINAL THREAD, LOOK AT THE FIRST POST IN THIS THREAD AND THE TOPIC OF THIS THREAD, AS THEY DID TO THE SAME TOPIC MANY TIMES BEFORE

Look at the first post in this thread.

Why is the topic of this thread "Why Are Paying Customers Being Silenced on Critical Topics?"

When they realized it is a bad PR, only then they allowed this thread.

Please learn your facts.

__Psycoder · July 12

MsScarlett said:
well the accusations just are recent.. so lets see how long it takes.

Oh yeah, when Kyronix gets back from whatever he is doing, I will be banned for bringing up the Nonono's years long housing monopoly. As I said, this wont be my first time for getting banned for bringing this topic up.

MsScarlett · July 12

I would hope that people reporting TOS infractions would not cause anyone to be banned.

__Psycoder · July 12

MsScarlett said:

I would hope that people reporting TOS infractions would not cause anyone to be banned.

Narrator's Voice: They did in fact ban people reporting TOS infractions.

MsScarlett · July 12

I don't doubt it but it seems like some legality issue if you follow their TOS and report using the tools they tell you to and then ban you for it.

__Psycoder · July 12

MsScarlett said:

I don't doubt it but it seems like some legality issue if you follow their TOS and report using the tools they tell you to and then ban you for it.

Well well, here is how it happens most of the time.

You bring up Nonono and his monopoly.
The thread will get closed for some reason. Either some trolls will take the topic offline, some people will start insulting others, or the mods will say enough is enough for some reason.
You create another topic, for me this usually involves using a hostile language because the original thread is closed/deleted without allowing a mature discussion.
But, when you created the 2nd topic after they closed the first time, you are already in breach of the forum rules. At this point it is irrelevant what the original thread said. The fact that you are creating multiple threads after they are closed makes it so that you are breaking the forum rules.
You keep repeating this action, with more and more hostile language, then you are banned.

To be honest, people could have had more mature discussion about nonono and his long housing monopoly. The fact that they are closing the topic for any excuse is what brings people to start having hostile behavior about this in the first place.

Here is what remember from the top of my memory.

The person in question, nonono, has had a housing monopoly for a long time now.
Everybody involved in the Atlatic housing space knows this.
His monopoly reached to such a bad state, 2 other scripters/developers got mad about it and started chasing him around. They finally figured out how he is doing it. Then they started using the same script and started placing houses before nonono.
The 2 developers/scripters that were placing the houses before nonono started giving houses free to other players that needed it for free.
At this point, the UO devs figured out how people were doing it and applied a patch.
The scripter I spoke with claims that Nonono himself went to UO devs and let them know how it is done. Because the 2 developers/scripters giving houses away for free was killing his business. He could no longer ask for 1.5 plat for house that normally sells for 500mil.
Nonono disappeared for a while.
I am not active at the housing anymore, but according to my guild mate, he started getting every single house once again. The fact that someone that is not in my guild started this thread and the original one makes me believe that my guild mate is right.

Now, I don't know if these will stay here. But looking the past behaviour from the mods here, it will be deleted and I will be banned.

__Psycoder · July 12

BTW, just to be clear. I am not innocent neither. I did and still use 3rd party apps. As I mentioned many times I have a minor disability and playing UO with the official client is impossible for me.

What pisses me off is that, here we have a guy that literally turned housing on Atlantic to hell alone. Nothing happened to him. Over the years, many people tried to get the devs pay attention to him, nothing happened.

Then there is me, I am literally in front of my computer. No GM sent me a message, no GM asked me anything, no GM transferred me to jail, no GM did anything. I log out, then hours after I log out, I am banned because I was AFK... ?????

Lokea · July 12

__Psycoder said:

MsScarlett said:

I would hope that people reporting TOS infractions would not cause anyone to be banned.

Narrator's Voice: They did in fact ban people reporting TOS infractions.

People have been reporting the multiboxer/scripter/whatever gargoyle bot trains that have been openly sweeping through Mistas and the dungeons on LS and they have not been banned. In fact, it seems like at least one or two bot trains have stopped altogether or are laying low. Don’t know if they were banned or talked to, but there were too many doing it way too openly.

Lokea · July 12

__Psycoder said:

turned housing on Atlantic to hell alone.

This is why I always chuckle when people on Atlantic tell me to “get off the dead shards” and go to Atlantic. I’m eligible for transfer shield vet rewards next month, and I’ll certainly shop on Atlantic a few times a month, but you couldn’t pay me to move there or have a house there. House prices there are nuts.

__Psycoder · July 12

Lokea said:
This is why I always chuckle when people on Atlantic tell me to “get off the dead shards” and go to Atlantic. I’m eligible for transfer shield vet rewards next month, and I’ll certainly shop on Atlantic a few times a month, but you couldn’t pay me to move there or have a house there. House prices there are nuts.

I am chatting with some guild friends since I was banned for being AFK while not AFK, 5-6 hours after I logged out...

Most people that I spoke to have had an account banned for one reason or another over the years. People literally had a 24 hour ban, because they built a fence around their CU while training it.

People in my guild that I spoke to about this told me that they believe Nonono must know someone to be going at it for this long. Nobody has a proof, but nobody believes he is doing it alone.

Anyways, before Nonono, you could find a good sized house for 300 mil. Atlantic was a good place back then.

__Psycoder · July 12

Right now he has an inventory of 10+ 18x18 or similar sized houses.

https://discord.com/channels/1378606555364069387/1386172961274204282

https://discord.com/channels/1378606555364069387/1387989010302898176

I will keep adding his inventory as he adds more... I have witnessed this guy place countless idocs with my own eyes. Let's see how long the producer can keep his quiet in the face of undeniable proof.

Starting the week after next week, I will post/update this topic every time he places an IDOC.

Grimbeard · July 13

Well despite you admitting to being a cheater the thread still open maybe it's how you're going about it?

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Why Are Paying Customers Being Silenced on Critical Topics?

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THEY SILENCED THE ORIGINAL THREAD, LOOK AT THE FIRST POST IN THIS THREAD AND THE TOPIC OF THIS THREAD, AS THEY DID TO THE SAME TOPIC MANY TIMES BEFORE