New Yukio's Quest : Do Partied Bards take credit for Party's kills ?

poppspopps Posts: 2,373
edited April 24 in General Discussions
As we know, other then by using Provocation whereas one MoB gets to kill another, Bards are pretty much a "support" character where, using Bard songs and Masteries, they "help out" their Party buddies with buffs and all that.

Now, they can get looting rights with their "supporting" songs (let's not count Provocation at all, for the sake of this discussion), right ?

What about getting actual "credit" towards Yukio's Quest kills requirements then ?

If they help their Party buddies, and their buddies get the kills, do the Bards also get the kills for their songs' support as one would think (as I said, let's leave Provocation entirely out of this... just using "support" songs...) ?

To clarify this better, the Bard is not hitting the Monsters with spells or Weapons, they are strictly role playing a Bard, that is, stick to singing support songs (let's leave Provocation out of this for the sake of this discussion) to help their Party Members who are the ones actually doing the kills.

Comments

  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 599
    Do you have a bard? Why not test it out and let us know?
  • GwenGwen Posts: 163
    I am playing a bard. I get credits for my suicidal AOE triton kills ( 200 STR, but load of HP, FWW, poison breath and spellweaving)  And I support it by songs and spamming area peace or discording lions, yamandons and yomotsu. 

    @popps , you also forget about fire horn. Gather mobs, blow horn at them, throw a flamming potion, than area peace  and run.  Let sampires finish those kappas. 
    Even 4*120 bard has 240 points left. Fencing + Ninjitsu (for FWW if you are not gargish) or Magery + eval (earthquake) will give you points. 
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,373
    Gwen said:
    I am playing a bard. I get credits for my suicidal AOE triton kills ( 200 STR, but load of HP, FWW, poison breath and spellweaving)  And I support it by songs and spamming area peace or discording lions, yamandons and yomotsu. 

    @ popps , you also forget about fire horn. Gather mobs, blow horn at them, throw a flamming potion, than area peace  and run.  Let sampires finish those kappas. 
    Even 4*120 bard has 240 points left. Fencing + Ninjitsu (for FWW if you are not gargish) or Magery + eval (earthquake) will give you points. 
    I am playing a bard. I get credits for my suicidal AOE triton kills ( 200 STR, but load of HP, FWW, poison breath and spellweaving)  And I support it by songs and spamming area peace or discording lions, yamandons and yomotsu. 
    That's more of a Bard/Tamer I would imagine....

    Sure, you support the Triton with the Bard songs but the actual kills credit comes from the Tamer part.... and the pet doing the kills...

    My argument for discussion, is more about a "pure" Party Bard..... a Bard who, most of the time, just supports his/her Party folks with buffs songs.... while the Party Members do the kills...

    That is, no "direct" killing from the Bard, not even with Provocation.... only a Bard that supports one's own Party Members with buffs songs.

    Would such a roleplaying Bard get credit for kills done exclusively by one's own Party Members (that is, not directly by the Bard) while the Bard supports theParty with buffs songs ?
  • CinderellaCinderella Posts: 1,232
    if your bard has magery, you can cast EVs and get credit.
    thats how a guild member used his bard
  • Arroth_ThaielArroth_Thaiel Posts: 743
    edited April 24
    In my personal experience:

    Bards running either of the Provocation or Discord Masteries get credit for kills and are included in artifact drop tables.

    Bards running either Peacemaking Mastery do not get credit for kills nor are they included in artifact drop tables.
    -Arroth
  • MerusMerus Posts: 377
    Looting rights for bards are the same as anything else... damage dealt, damage taken or damage healed.  If you use a disco mastery song to damage or a provoke song to heal you get credit.  Peace songs don’t deal or heal damage so they won’t get you credit.
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,373
    if your bard has magery, you can cast EVs and get credit.
    thats how a guild member used his bard
    That's not my point.

    My point is, about a role Playing Bard getting "kills'Credit" WITHOUT doing direct kills...

    But, rather, being, aheam, a BARD.... that is, using "support Songs" to help out that Bard's Party Members who would be the ones doing the direct kills.... the Bard, only doing the support songs...

    Sort of like a role playing "Healer"....

    Does a Healer get "Credits' Kills" towards Yukio's Quest for healing out one's own Party Members who would be the ones doing the direct kills ?

    Forget about a Bard killing stuff directly..... my argument is, rather, whether a Bard (or a Healer for that Matter), would get "Credits' Kills" towards Yukio's Quest for roleplaying a Bard (or a Healer) who support one's own Party Members with Songs (or Heals) and do NOT do any direct kills.
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,373
    In my personal experience:

    Bards running either of the Provocation or Discord Masteries get credit for kills and are included in artifact drop tables.

    Bards running either Peacemaking Mastery do not get credit for kills nor are they included in artifact drop tables.
    Sounds weird to me...

    Why this discrimination among Bard's songs ?
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 599
    @popps - You already used this argument for other events. Give it a break. I doubt you even have a bard. Using your logic, I should get credit for kills by just casting bless on everyone actually doing damage to get credit. Think how fast that would go... I'd bless all the warriors and get credit for 40 kappas / deathwatch beetles in 30 seconds. 

    Troll less. Play the game more.
  • Arroth_ThaielArroth_Thaiel Posts: 743
    popps said:
    In my personal experience:

    Bards running either of the Provocation or Discord Masteries get credit for kills and are included in artifact drop tables.

    Bards running either Peacemaking Mastery do not get credit for kills nor are they included in artifact drop tables.
    Sounds weird to me...

    Why this discrimination among Bard's songs ?
    Merus said:
    Looting rights for bards are the same as anything else... damage dealt, damage taken or damage healed.  If you use a disco mastery song to damage or a provoke song to heal you get credit.  Peace songs don’t deal or heal damage so they won’t get you credit.

    -Arroth
  • looploop Posts: 95
    The mechanics for getting loot rights are very forgiving. As others have mentioned, support-only bards -- you might be the only one in the entire game -- are no more "discriminated" against than, say, a mage who casts only buffs (and who would do that?).

    One of the interesting things about UO is its classless system, and we needn't think of a player's combat role solely in terms of damage, support, healing, etc. Generally speaking, any combat-oriented template can do a bit everything, and what better way to further support your party as a bard than by doing a minimal amount of damage to enemies while you maintain buffs?

    I did the quest with my 4x mystic bard. It took longer than my necromage, sure, but on the whole this event is more friendly to bard's than, say, the Ice event which had paragons you couldn't provoke.

    These events come but once a month or so, and they're designed to encourage as much participation as possible. Would it be good to have less combat-oriented content? Sure, but designing that content is a little more nuanced, and even then we can't expect that content to accommodate every niche roleplay style like, for instance, a hippie bard who wants to make love not war.
  • MerusMerus Posts: 377
    I actually like having the ability to use bard songs without screwing up drops/rights.  I use the peacemaking songs all the time as a protector at spawns.  He can discord and run the songs without impacting scrolls.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,654
    edited April 25
    Merus said:
    I actually like having the ability to use bard songs without screwing up drops/rights.  I use the peacemaking songs all the time as a protector at spawns.  He can discord and run the songs without impacting scrolls.
    A player that likes to do Shrine battles with me made a bard.  With his peace and me running Provo songs.  My brand new toons can stand toe to toe with the Captains.
    Provo songs do more damage to Beacons. 
    We always take a Bard to Corgul. 
    If someone thinks Bards songs are not powerful, they do not use them.
    Would be nice if @popps asked how they can use their template to the best advantage instead of claiming they are not useful.

    I do not think Popps will have an intelligent counter to what Loop said.  It seems all Popps wants to do is counter any good advice with rubbish.
  • MerusMerus Posts: 377
    loop said:
    The mechanics for getting loot rights are very forgiving. As others have mentioned, support-only bards -- you might be the only one in the entire game -- are no more "discriminated" against than, say, a mage who casts only buffs (and who would do that?).

    One of the interesting things about UO is its classless system, and we needn't think of a player's combat role solely in terms of damage, support, healing, etc. Generally speaking, any combat-oriented template can do a bit everything, and what better way to further support your party as a bard than by doing a minimal amount of damage to enemies while you maintain buffs?

    I did the quest with my 4x mystic bard. It took longer than my necromage, sure, but on the whole this event is more friendly to bard's than, say, the Ice event which had paragons you couldn't provoke.

    These events come but once a month or so, and they're designed to encourage as much participation as possible. Would it be good to have less combat-oriented content? Sure, but designing that content is a little more nuanced, and even then we can't expect that content to accommodate every niche roleplay style like, for instance, a hippie bard who wants to make love not war.
    I also did the quest on my 4xlegendary bard with magery and med on the template... I just use a 3 slot vollem and call it good.  I run the provo songs for healing, discord the mobs and use the vollem to kill.  If it gets really hairy I can hope of my ethy and drop an extra EV.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,654
    edited April 30
    I decided to drag the Bard around on my warrior tonight.  Bard got credit for the yamatsu guys very well since my warrior took damage, also the Bard would auto shoot sometimes. Was lucky at the spawn, it was 2nd and 3rd level mobs the whole time. So my warrior finished it in a decent time but the bard got few credits for the Kappas or beetles.  Wolves were decent, I let them hit my warrior and the bard got credit.  Yamandon was surprisingly easy for my warrior.  I had not fought it on my warrior since I was wearing an ancient samurai helm. The bard song was enough to keep him at full HP and he killed it quick.

    But, It took the warrior a lot longer to kill almost everything except for the yamandon than it takes on my tamer.  Warrior took over an hour.  Pet eats through everything except the yamandon in a couple of bites.  Warrior took multiple swings on everything. 
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