Major Crafting Update

Bilbo

Pawain said:

Reforging made us start using normal materials.  Ship chests have color ingots and wood.

I understand what @ McDougle is saying.  But disagree that it should not be that way. Reforging is much better than imbuing armor.

But it is not on par with loot and that is the major down fall for high end crafters.  Crafting did not grow at the same rate as loot did so we fell further and further behind every year that the loot table was increased.  I don't expect to make the most uber gear but I would like to make something that people would be proud to wear and at least be competitive.

Pawain

All my dexxers wear crafted armor pieces to get the highest stamina and mana possible with everything else.
Most of my jewelry is crafted or crafted from SSI pieces that were looted.
All my weapons are crafted.

popps

Bilbo said:

popps said:

Bilbo said:

And as far as you crafters doing anything in towns for other people that died with AoS.

And, with the due right changes, it could be brought back as it once was in Ultima Online.... making crafting machines would not be, to my opinion, a right change in that direction....

Crafting has always been one of the important aspects of UO, but it was taken away when it was allowed to players to become self sufficient and use crafters as a tool for their fighters...

If accounts were to be specialized, like being either fighting accounts OR crafters accounts, at least to make the good and high end stuff, then crafters would be back in business to be of service at least to those other players not having multiple accounts....

How to achieve this ?

Easy, players would need to "declare" their account either a fighting account OR a crafters account and this, if they declared it a crafters account, would "open up" new crafting options for high end items....

So, a fighters declared account could still have crafters and use them BUT, only to make mid to low end stuff.... only an account fully devoted to crafting could have access to making the good, high end stuff....

Of course, the same would be for a fighting declared account which would have access to fighting prowess that a crafters declared accounts would not have.... 

Sort of like some "uber masteries".... declaring an entire account for either fighting or crafting would enable these uber masteries in either type and, of course, a crafters account could still have characters in it capable of fighting, but not as good and as proficiently as a fighting declared account would be able to....

Needless to say, that free, Endless Journey accounts, would be made incapacitated to make such a focusing  declaration of either being a Crafters or a Fighters account and, therefore, could only have access to mid to low abilities as compared to a fully subscribed account... of course, if an EJ account was to turn into a subscribed account, then such a focused declaration that would a unlock either that fighters or crafters high end content would become available.

Sure, players with multiple accounts could still get both worlds, but they also would pay double subscriptions....  which I guess it would be good news for the upkeep of Ultima Online...

At least, those who wanted to play a focused Crafters account could still do business with those players with only 1 account focused on fighting and, thus, needing others' crafting services for the really good, high end crafting stuff...

This is only 1 suggestions, likely more could pop up with due thinking... the real point here, is whether the Developers are interested in bringing back crafting in Ultima Online as a serious and focused main activity for players, as it once was in UO....

@ Kyronix , @ Bleak , what are your thoughts about crafting in UO ?

Do you want it to be subject and subordinated to players who use it mainly and mostly to be self sufficient with their fighting characters or do you instead want to bring it back to the splendor and relevance which it once was, in Ultima Online ?

No it can not because a crafter can not come close to what drops as loot. 

Cannot come close ?

How so ?

The Developers can Design crafting as they want and please and see as right for their game....

It is not a question of whether it can or not be done, because, at least to my viewing, it sure can be done... it is only a matter of wanting to do it or not.....

popps

Pawain said:

@ popps said:
The more that Crafting is simplified, made easy, convenient like having a crafting machine that "does it", the more players will become self-sufficient because also those few players who, now, do not want to bother with crafting and have the gold to pay other players who, instead, enjoy playing a crafter, the less that real, focused Crafters will have "customers" to sell their services to.

So in one thread you want to make crafting easier by increasing how many BODs we can get.  That will lead to crafters not trading BODs because they have their own BODs.  If you want crafters to interact you should want 1 BOD per day so crafters have to interact with others to fill large BODs.

Apples and Oranges.....

I did not say to increase the number of BODs.

I only said, rather then 3 BODs caches every 18 hours to do 4 every 24 hours, period.

Already a Crafter can get 4 BODs every 24 hours NOW, as we speak.... only, they need to log at 18 AND at 24 hours, but they can, if so they wish.

I only suggested to make it that they were to log once, rather then twice, to get their 4 BODs.

Does not look to me as increasing the number of BODs received at all.... just alleviating the tediousness to have to log a second time at 24 hours... but definitively, it is no increase at all.

You want us to choose to make our accounts crafter or fighter?  Are you not the poster who constantly wants to do Mob killing events with templates that are not made to kill? But now you want other players to choose what their account can do at start up?

Variety, to my viewing, is what makes Ultima Online a great game to play.

When there is 1 Template that obliterates all others, because it gets gold, rewards etc. faster, easier and better as other Templates, then players, even if reluctantly, sooner or later get forced to get to play that Template rather then the other Templates which they enjoy playing more... and then we see only or mostly ONE Template being played in the game.... how many times have I been told to go make a Sampire and shut up even if I enjoy playing other Templates and would like to be given a way to get those same rewards and gold using thoseother Templates and not necessarily a Sampire ??

With Crafting, it is the same.... the more that Crafting is being used to service one's own Fighters and be self-sufficient, the LESS all those players who actually ENJOY playing a Crafter (how dare anyone even think of wanting to play and enjoy a character that is not a geared up and uber-killing machine Warrior ?? /sarcasm....) will be able to play those Crafters because they will hardly have any other fellow players to have business with....

I imagine, that this is what Game Designers do.... they make a grand plan of what is best for their Digital World, and make it come to life......

My question to the Developers is, do they want Crafting in Ultima Online to be subordinated and subject to Fighters (as to my opinion it pretty much is now....), with players quite unable to play a Crafter in most of their time in Ultima Online, as their MAIN character and not just one in "support" of their Fighter Characters, OR, do the Developers want to conceive and make due changes so as to make Crafting make a come back as it once was in Ultima Online, where players COULD play a Crafter most of their in game time, because Fighters would go to them for their crafting needs and services ?

@Kyronix , @Bleak , what do you want for the Digital World of Ultima Online and thus for us players as in regards to Crafting and all those folks who would like to spend most of their in game time Crafting, and not Fighting ?

Cookie

McDougle said:

One thing i would like to see changed is needing mining/lumberjack to craft with ore/woods i have not used either mining or lumberjack since high seas came out...

I still use my miner, and lumberjack, I've never done High Sea's - I really need someone to show me lol, I have the boat! Just no sailors on my account

I've heard you get a lot of stuff. Maybe if this new event has good rewards I will be forced onto a boat

Cookie

Pawain said:

I realize they will never let us put crafting skills on a machine but damn we could have a little fun and dream.

And yes, a lot of these ideas are just that, us throwing stuff out there, knowing it will not happen, but that's ok. Sometimes we have a great idea, and sometimes it happens.

keven2002

I think the major crafting update shouldn't really be about transferring skills as originally outlined but rather be making the skills that we have for crafting actually make usable goods (whether it be from crafting/imbuing/reforging or a combination).   As @Bilbo said, crafters cannot compete with the intensity of legendary items and it's not even close. Aside from maybe 1 imbued piece that has HP/Stam/Dex/Mana none of my characters use crafted armor (aside from cuffs and feudal grips).

@popps - If you want a crafter to be relevant as a main character, you can do so on Siege Perilous. Give it a try.

@McDougle - You don't need mining or lumberjacking to craft anything if you have the resources. The only thing mining helps with on a crafter is their ability to recover more ingots upon smelting.

popps

keven2002 said:

If you want a crafter to be relevant as a main character, you can do so on Siege Perilous. Give it a try.

Aside from the fact that Felucca ruleset is not the cup of tea favoured by many players, me included, Endless Journey accounts are free, not even a dime a dozen... and that defies totally the 1 character per account of Siege.... one can have all Crafters they want on Siege and be self sufficient just fine... furthermore, with the very low playerbase on that Shard, one would imagine the economy to be quite stagnant...

So, I am afraid, that would not be a good nor viable solution to many players wanting or enjoying Crafting.... I would rather see Crafting be made valuable once again for Trammel ruleset facets...

keven2002

popps said:

keven2002 said:

If you want a crafter to be relevant as a main character, you can do so on Siege Perilous. Give it a try.

Aside from the fact that Felucca ruleset is not the cup of tea favoured by many players, me included, Endless Journey accounts are free, not even a dime a dozen... and that defies totally the 1 character per account of Siege.... one can have all Crafters they want on Siege and be self sufficient just fine... furthermore, with the very low playerbase on that Shard, one would imagine the economy to be quite stagnant...

So, I am afraid, that would not be a good nor viable solution to many players wanting or enjoying Crafting.... I would rather see Crafting be made valuable once again for Trammel ruleset facets...

My message was directed to you and not all other players because it's my understanding that YOU are the only player that has requested consistently that a crafter be relevant as a main char. You have also been told by several others previously that Siege is NOT actually dead or stagnant. 

Once again you are directly offered a solution but rather than take the solution and give it a try, you'd rather deflect and act like your individual request speaks for the masses (and rarely do you actually speak for more than yourself or a few others). It's almost as if you don't actually care about a solution but rather just prefer to debate the topic into oblivion. 

Make a crafter as your main or don't... I really don't care either way but this will be the last time I try to help you understand how to do what it is you are asking for.

Garth_Grey

"I love what Popps has again done to a thread"...said no one ever. FYI @Kyronix if you're reading this one, Heartwood boards have stopped spawning on any ship. And while you're checking that out, would it be possible to have saltpeter spawn as loot ? It makes no sense that ore of all types is carried but not the salt peter. You're welcome.

Regarding Saltpeter, yes I know, miners like mining it up , they can keep doing it. No one sells saltpeter, check your VS and you'll see..no one is mining Saltpeter and selling it back to the NPC, check your shard, the price is through the roof because everyone is buying it up. This change of putting it in ship holds as loot hurts absolutely no one. Ships should carry black powder too, it only makes sense that they should carry everything ammo related.

Jepeth

keven2002 said:

My message was directed to you and not all other players because it's my understanding that YOU are the only player that has requested consistently that a crafter be relevant as a main char. 

You are incorrect

popps

Garth_Grey said:

"I love what Popps has again done to a thread"...said no one ever. FYI @ Kyronix if you're reading this one, Heartwood boards have stopped spawning on any ship. And while you're checking that out, would it be possible to have saltpeter spawn as loot ? It makes no sense that ore of all types is carried but not the salt peter. You're welcome.

Regarding Saltpeter, yes I know, miners like mining it up , they can keep doing it. No one sells saltpeter, check your VS and you'll see..no one is mining Saltpeter and selling it back to the NPC, check your shard, the price is through the roof because everyone is buying it up. This change of putting it in ship holds as loot hurts absolutely no one. Ships should carry black powder too, it only makes sense that they should carry everything ammo related.

Actually, it is possible to buy Saltpeter from NPCs Alchemists at the Floating Harbour, Moonglow and Britain Docks.... doubled, in Trammel and Felucca..... enjoy.....

https://uo.com/wiki/ultima-online-wiki/gameplay/crafting/cannons/

Resources:

Most resources are crafted (see table below) however saltpeter is bought from the alchemists at Sea Market, the docks at Moonglow or Britain,  or mined from niter deposits in dungeons or from boats. Only miners with high luck can find these deposits which can occur in 5 different sizes, miners harvesting in Felucca will benefit from a 1000 point luck bonus. Once found the miner must mine the deposit until it is consumed. The niter will decay if not mined when found.

Victim_Of_Siege

This would be a more useful thread without the walls in the way.  @Garth_Grey , I back your idea here, because to be used, you would first have to work the skills up. after they are worked, up this idea, unless i was cornfused by all the useless crap posted by some "build the wall" poster, would work just like soul stones by holding all the crafting skills. did i get it right? if so it is a grand idea.

McDougle

it used to be you got the you have no idea how to work this strange metal/wood message now keep in mind i don't craft much from anything other than iron/reg wood to be reforged and imbued..

Pawain

popps said:

Actually, it is possible to buy Saltpeter from NPCs Alchemists at the Floating Harbour, Moonglow and Britain Docks.... doubled, in Trammel and Felucca..... enjoy.....

He said Vendor Search has none for sale.
He said no one is selling it to the NPC everyone is buying so the price is high on the NPC...

After you sink a few ships you never need to make cannon ingredients because every pirate ship has more than it takes to sink a pirate ship in their hold.

I'm sure when "A Pirates Life" comes out you will be claim to be an expert at pirating and want to change things.

keven2002

@Garth_Grey - what's the reason you want salt peter and black powder? I'm assuming to make cannon ammo? If that's the case ships already have all 4 ammo items so aside from being just more (unmade) ammo not sure why you wouldn't just scuttle more ships or ask for the ammo to be increased in a hold.

Personally I've never had an ammo shortage once I get the first 20-30 rounds as long as I keep scuttling ships and don't pass them up for plunderbeacons.

Pawain

After sinking and looting a few pirate ships you will never need to make or go get more cannon ingredients  unless:
You leave your ship public and someone takes your cannons.
You don't repair your cannon and it blows up.
You leave your ship at sea without boarding it for 7 days and it goes poof.

I have had all 3 happen.

Garth_Grey

keven2002 said:

@ Garth_Grey - what's the reason you want salt peter and black powder? I'm assuming to make cannon ammo? If that's the case ships already have all 4 ammo items so aside from being just more (unmade) ammo not sure why you wouldn't just scuttle more ships or ask for the ammo to be increased in a hold.

Personally I've never had an ammo shortage once I get the first 20-30 rounds as long as I keep scuttling ships and don't pass them up for plunderbeacons.

I'm actually thinking of the new players that get into the High Seas game. If they don't have a miner or can't stand to mine, or if they don't have the 350+ gold per single saltpeter to buy and then gather the other ingredients to craft , someone like myself that enjoys the High Seas and acquires ridiculous amounts of the stuff could keep a fair priced vendor up and make a decent UO living. It simply makes sense that NPC ships would carry anything ammo related. They spawn sand in stacks of 500...wtf ?

Pawain

Garth_Grey said:

I'm actually thinking of the new players that get into the High Seas game. If they don't have a miner or can't stand to mine, or if they don't have the 350+ gold per single saltpeter to buy and then gather the other ingredients to craft , someone like myself that enjoys the High Seas and acquires ridiculous amounts of the stuff could keep a fair priced vendor up and make a decent UO living. It simply makes sense that NPC ships would carry anything ammo related. They spawn sand in stacks of 500...wtf ?

Sounds good, Ill put bags of 15 of each cannon ingredient in a bag and stick it on my Steward and players can get 15 shots on me if they say the magic word.

I love ruining event sales for other vendors.

 All set, Cannon ammo,charges,fuses 15 free on LS ask for Allen.

The_Higgs_1

*searches for south park gif "theyre trying to take our jobs!!"*

Kyronix

@Garth_Grey - Re: Heartwood Boards what ships are you targeting and where those ships are located?

Re: your proposed idea, probably a non-starter.  The idea that the character is the container by which skills are executed is a pretty fundamental design principle of the game world.  Sure, we've pushed the boundaries by introducing QoL items, such as the ones you mention, but ultimately the character is the final conduit by which a skill is executed.  I don't see that changing.  Thanks for the input though!

Bilbo

Victim_Of_Siege said:

This would be a more useful thread without the walls in the way.  @ Garth_Grey , I back your idea here, because to be used, you would first have to work the skills up. after they are worked, up this idea, unless i was cornfused by all the useless crap posted by some "build the wall" poster, would work just like soul stones by holding all the crafting skills. did i get it right? if so it is a grand idea.

The main draw back to his suggestion was that it could be sold with the skills still on it and those skills could be removed by a different account thus making it possible the selling of skills in UO and that is the only draw back to his idea.

Victim_Of_Siege

Bilbo said:

Victim_Of_Siege said:

This would be a more useful thread without the walls in the way.  @ Garth_Grey , I back your idea here, because to be used, you would first have to work the skills up. after they are worked, up this idea, unless i was cornfused by all the useless crap posted by some "build the wall" poster, would work just like soul stones by holding all the crafting skills. did i get it right? if so it is a grand idea.

The main draw back to his suggestion was that it could be sold with the skills still on it and those skills could be removed by a different account thus making it possible the selling of skills in UO and that is the only draw back to his idea.

Thanks for the Clarification. i do kinda like the idea and it could be implemented without being able to sell it with skills on it, since there would be no real difference between this machine (being account bound when skills are in it) and stoning skills around to other characters. ah well, still a great idea @Garth_Grey

Victim_Of_Siege

Kyronix said:

@ Garth_Grey - Re: Heartwood Boards what ships are you targeting and where those ships are located?

Re: your proposed idea, probably a non-starter.  The idea that the character is the container by which skills are executed is a pretty fundamental design principle of the game world.  Sure, we've pushed the boundaries by introducing QoL items, such as the ones you mention, but ultimately the character is the final conduit by which a skill is executed.  I don't see that changing.  Thanks for the input though!

Personally i hunt Tokuno waters and i haven't seen heartwood on any of the ships lately. i'll get the good chests on them occasionally that have the valorite, Verite, Agapite ingots and then it will have just Frostwood and Bloodwood boards in multiple stacks. they used to have heartwood IIRC.  I am seeing this on Siege, Origin, and Atlantic. I was filling up the Vesper Coffers on Siege this weekend by Piratin' (Arrr!) for a couple of hours and did not see any Heartwood but did collect a couple thousand of each of the other above mentioned high-end resources. 

Cookie

Kyronix said:

@ Garth_Grey - Re: Heartwood Boards what ships are you targeting and where those ships are located?

Re: your proposed idea, probably a non-starter.  The idea that the character is the container by which skills are executed is a pretty fundamental design principle of the game world.  Sure, we've pushed the boundaries by introducing QoL items, such as the ones you mention, but ultimately the character is the final conduit by which a skill is executed.  I don't see that changing.  Thanks for the input though!

And thank you for the response - Logical. Nice idea though.

Victim_Of_Siege

@Kyronix, i had opportunity to play this weekend and dusted off the pirate ship for some fun.  I was in Tokuno and scuttled 100+ ships of all type.  not one of them had any hardwood boards. I have enclosed a typical container on a merchant vessel (this includes both types of ship.) you would think that these would have at least one stack of heartwood boards.

keven2002

@Kyronix - I'm also wondering if it's possible to consolidate the same type resources that are in the same box (ie pic in above post would have 1 stack of bloodwood (150) / 1 stack frostwood (150) / 1 stack verite ingots (250) / etc)?

Having to click and drag the above pic 24x for just 6 actual resources is tedious for items in the same box and doesn't really make sense from any perspective (aside from maybe making it take longer to loot by having to click 4 times more than needed); you would think sailors would want thing condensed for onloading and offloading. 

Garth_Grey

Victim_Of_Siege said:

@ Kyronix, i had opportunity to play this weekend and dusted off the pirate ship for some fun.  I was in Tokuno and scuttled 100+ ships of all type.  not one of them had any hardwood boards. I have enclosed a typical container on a merchant vessel (this includes both types of ship.) you would think that these would have at least one stack of heartwood boards.

Same experience, I've also noticed that Dread Pirates have completely stopped their random Legendary piece. It wasn't very often, but it was almost guaranteed every 5 or 6 Dreads, over the last week I've killed 300 or so, not a single Legendary piece.

Kyronix

We haven't changed anything so any "all of a sudden" scenario is likely the side effects of RNG.  That's not to say there couln't be an issue, but it'd require quite a bit of digging and right now, heartwood on ships isn't a very high priority.  

Bilbo

Garth_Grey said:

I have every crafting station as I"m sure many players also have, I would gladly turn them all in for a single stand alone unit.

I had all the stations but they take up more space than I have set up for my crafting area so I sold them all.  It would be great if we could combine them into multi units and they do save space when storing kits to craft with.  20 - 250 use crafting kits per skill vice one station of 5000 uses really isn't my problem.  Now if they could store all my runics at 5000 uses each per type now that would be an upgrade, those take up a lot of room/lock downs.