Regarding the Poison EL Paragons

  They are a bit over the top and they start adding up FAST on lower pop shards.  Nothing against Dexers but they won't kill them or even rams for that matter unless they see a tamers pat tanking it for them. Takes a month of Sundays for a tamers pet to kill one (rams a take little while but are reasonable)  At best the PE Paragons take ALL of the fun out of dungeon and at its worst makes the dungeon simply undoable when every place you run to there is at least 1 if not 2-3 of them.  Really need to get rid of them on the low pop shards or reduce their spawn rate way down.  There is hard and then there is "This is just stupid"  Tried helping a couple of guys get their corpses on the back side of level 1 this morning.  Even with me leading as many of them away as I could they still could not make it half way back to their corpses and the corpses finally decayed.  Real enjoyable game time for them and a waste of their money on the store pots.

  This is not a problem on Shards like LS and Atlantic where everything that might give a drop gets swarmed by numerous people.  Might be a stretch but in the future it might be nice to scale the event dungeon difficulty based on the number of people in the dungeon. Or scale to the dungeon level like 1 being easier and capped at say Liche Lord Paragons, LvL 2 capped at ram paragons and level 3 anything goes.  With the % chance of rewards/drops increasing with each level as the difficulty and risk increase.  Would let the less skilled players enjoy the content and it not be just BOOM INSTANT DEATH because someone ran out and left 2-3 PE ELS right at the entrance. 

  LOL and a skeleton paragon that reveals 10 tiles away is just as good at ruining a scripters day as a PE EL :)  PE ELS seem to have no effect on the multi box players running their cross healing scrips though.  4-6 Multi Box toons cross healing take them down very fast. ANd those scumbags are or were actually kind of handy for keeping the PE ELS in check initially guess they have moved on to another shard to farm now.

Comments

  • My Macer Paladin doesn't have much of a problem handling any Paragon in there. Stagger helps a lot for reducing incoming damage from a Paragon, for it applies a -60% SSI debuff for 10 secs, and can be refreshed. This really cuts down on how often the Poison Ele applies Lethal Poison to you with his melee since it drastically slows his attack speed, therefore allowing my bandies to kick in and heal damage.
    Nice to see X-Healing Warriors become a thing again. With Sampires being so dominant for so long, X-Healing had basically become a long last, ancient Chinese secret only taught by the Greybeards at the top of High Hrothgar. A nearly extinct lost art.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,648
    edited October 2020
    You can take a tamer and back off slowly.  Then the ele will stay on the pet. Pet takes a lot of damage.  Then bring your Warrior in.  (Then a samp runs by and we die lol)

    Yup, wish we had that problem.  Our sampires pass em by but the core players call em out and we kick their butts.

    I thought these dynamic events were dynamic because the spawn changes for the amount of participants.  Are they supposed to @Kyronix ; Also please turn on Fel deceit, we need stuff to kill!

    Or you can keep them away from you using Energy fields, they break them so keep 2 up.
  • Tyrath said:
    ...PE ELS seem to have no effect on the multi box players running their cross healing scrips though.  4-6 Multi Box toons cross healing take them down very fast. ANd those scumbags are or were actually kind of handy for keeping the PE ELS in check initially guess they have moved on to another shard to farm now.
    I've been trying to run 2 x-healers. Doesn't really work that well. You're not really that nimble and quick having to manage and move multiple accounts. Well, at least I'm not. Maybe if I was in the CC and using "follow" it would be easier, or if I was macro-grouping the windows.

    Plus, people see two fighters standing side by side and immediately lure everything they can to you. Sometimes the luring is on purpose and consistent and over and over. Other times I think players are just looking for help killing off a paragon, and don't realize the x-healers are not invulnerable and can get overwhelmed. When the x-healers go down though it can be chaos and lots of ghosts!

    It seems few remember the old Deceit bone wall and to keep the x-healers alive for your own safety. Which is especially sad since the event is in Deceit!

    Judging from the drop rates posted by others, you're probably going to get twice the drops running a single SDI tamer or Pure Paladin/Samurai, then from running 2 (individually managed) x-healers. 
    -Arroth
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,648
    You are braver than I to try to run two melee healers.  Id last 10 seconds.
  • TyrathTyrath Posts: 294
    Tyrath said:
    ...PE ELS seem to have no effect on the multi box players running their cross healing scrips though.  4-6 Multi Box toons cross healing take them down very fast. ANd those scumbags are or were actually kind of handy for keeping the PE ELS in check initially guess they have moved on to another shard to farm now.
    I've been trying to run 2 x-healers. Doesn't really work that well. You're not really that nimble and quick having to manage and move multiple accounts. Well, at least I'm not. Maybe if I was in the CC and using "follow" it would be easier, or if I was macro-grouping the windows.

    Plus, people see two fighters standing side by side and immediately lure everything they can to you. Sometimes the luring is on purpose and consistent and over and over. Other times I think players are just looking for help killing off a paragon, and don't realize the x-healers are not invulnerable and can get overwhelmed. When the x-healers go down though it can be chaos and lots of ghosts!

    It seems few remember the old Deceit bone wall and to keep the x-healers alive for your own safety. Which is especially sad since the event is in Deceit!

    Judging from the drop rates posted by others, you're probably going to get twice the drops running a single SDI tamer or Pure Paladin/Samurai, then from running 2 (individually managed) x-healers. 

     What you are describing is multi client not multi box where multiple acccts are chained to the same mouse and key strokes with scripts casting greater heals and slinging the bandages automatically for the cross healing. 

     But Multi Box and Multi Clienting is not the primary issue, the event dungeons at some point getting packed with high end PE Paragons and thus making it unplayable on low pop shards is the issue at hand.  Sure above average and Elite players have no problems in them.  The average and casual player have no chance in them after a certain point.  Even then I see a lot of the so called elite running out for a Rez and using honor to get back to their corpse :)

      Pawain is about as average of a player as I am :)   So us being able to do well in this dungeon is not a fair metric to judge the difficulty of the system by. Other than we both die a lot in there as well.  What saves me in the dungeon is keeping sacrifice and honor up Not hard to find a semi safe place to self rez with all of yer pack intact and using honor to stroll by mobs of PE Para Els is nice. Speaking of that I need to go dump my fame on a demon and run the Hag quest a couple dozen times to get sacrifice back to knight and spend a hour or so with the balrons getting honor back up :)

      But in the future the event dungeons really need to scale so that the people that are not retired old farts like myself and the folks living and playing on our tax dollars do not have such a large advantage in game.  Like I said challenging is fun making it impossible for a large segment of the player base is NOT........ at least not on many of the shards that don't have 50-100 people in the dungeon killing everything that moves 23/7.


  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,648
    I found a way that works with my tamer for killing the Para Poisons and Rams.
    A team of 2  can do this, I do with 2 accounts.

    Find the target. Lead it to a spot where no other spawn will be. My fav spot is 3rd floor telepad. 
    I  Sacred Journey out.  Then make a gate to that spot. Send in tamer first. Put pet on target.  The target has yet to change to my tamer because when I get there I walk back a few spaces. If needed I could invis.  Then switch to Melee toon. He goes in same gate, Target switches to him. But he can heal with bandies and keep using specials. 

    I kill the Para Poisons in 20 to 30 seconds.  The Rams take a minute. I use a macer with a war hammer. Use Stagger and hit with crushing blow.  I am using my undead slayer weapon, I could kill them faster if I used an ele weapon.  But they disarm and I fumble around later.
    The only time I have trouble is when someone runs by and the target switches to my tamer.  I invis him, step back start again. 

    I have killed at least 20 this way tonight, we have a lot of paras on the third level. Only died once when someone ran by and the melee guy accidentally went in the teleporter and there was a Para LL and ram there.

    So basically a Team of a tamer and a melee can run around and when they come to a paragon, invis both, put pet on it, then melee guy. The tamer can heal the melee guy and invis himself if needed.

    Also if two melee toons are running together they can also take on any single paragon and kill even faster.

    Teamwork.
  • TyrathTyrath Posts: 294
    My Macer Paladin doesn't have much of a problem handling any Paragon in there. Stagger helps a lot for reducing incoming damage from a Paragon, for it applies a -60% SSI debuff for 10 secs, and can be refreshed. This really cuts down on how often the Poison Ele applies Lethal Poison to you with his melee since it drastically slows his attack speed, therefore allowing my bandies to kick in and heal damage.
    Nice to see X-Healing Warriors become a thing again. With Sampires being so dominant for so long, X-Healing had basically become a long last, ancient Chinese secret only taught by the Greybeards at the top of High Hrothgar. A nearly extinct lost art.

     Two Warriors slapping bandages on each other is still one of the most effective ways of dominating higher end content.  But as you say as the sampire came to dominate and UO largely became a single player game with occasional joint ventures it did lose its popularity until it was almost extinct other than a couple of us old tag team farts that still run it and the multi boxers found it was a very good way to keep all of their chained accounts alive. 

     This dungeon is perfect for 2-3 people cross healing and working together. Wish my old friend and partner in game logged in more often we were a very good cross healing team back in the day. Drawback is you can't run around like a chicken with yer head cutoff and have to work side by side and be as dependable as you expect yer partners to be.  But yep good see something as obsolete as cross healing being rediscovered and folks learning it really is not so obsolete. Always kind of surprised me that PvM Guilds did not keep it incorporated into their play styles. Don't see it being effective in PvP anymore but I may be wrong, I gave PvP up after AOS and became a in game pacifist LOL. So I could be dead wrong about it being viable in PvP.
  • TyrathTyrath Posts: 294
    Pawain said:
    I found a way that works with my tamer for killing the Para Poisons and Rams.
    A team of 2  can do this, I do with 2 accounts.

    Find the target. Lead it to a spot where no other spawn will be. My fav spot is 3rd floor telepad. 
    I  Sacred Journey out.  Then make a gate to that spot. Send in tamer first. Put pet on target.  The target has yet to change to my tamer because when I get there I walk back a few spaces. If needed I could invis.  Then switch to Melee toon. He goes in same gate, Target switches to him. But he can heal with bandies and keep using specials. 

    I kill the Para Poisons in 20 to 30 seconds.  The Rams take a minute. I use a macer with a war hammer. Use Stagger and hit with crushing blow.  I am using my undead slayer weapon, I could kill them faster if I used an ele weapon.  But they disarm and I fumble around later.
    The only time I have trouble is when someone runs by and the target switches to my tamer.  I invis him, step back start again. 

    I have killed at least 20 this way tonight, we have a lot of paras on the third level. Only died once when someone ran by and the melee guy accidentally went in the teleporter and there was a Para LL and ram there.

    So basically a Team of a tamer and a melee can run around and when they come to a paragon, invis both, put pet on it, then melee guy. The tamer can heal the melee guy and invis himself if needed.

    Also if two melee toons are running together they can also take on any single paragon and kill even faster.

    Teamwork.

     I just run it with one acct and use pretty much the same tactic for not getting targeted except I use smoke bombs and invis pots.  LOL only reason I was running 6-12 on Batlin was to get their tallies and later to help folks out that were still trying to get their tallies.  Get target pop smoke or chug a pot and keep healing the pet and running consume.  Problem comes when there are 5 PEs at the bottom of the steps and 2 more in the first hallway.   And then here comes the L33T Dexxer with the two in the hallways in tow and dies right before the steps and now yer butt deep in PE Paragons and at least 2-3 others lesser paragons.  No pet can stand up to that many paragons, heck no 4 pets would survive it and as soon as you reveal from invising at least 3-4 of them target you. So you run up the steps and Gee someone left one or two ram or PE paragons parked there for you.  LOL I made it a point to not do deceit on LS unless one certain dexxer was not down there because she intentionally would drag every paragon she could find right to you. Gotta remember to throw nut paste on her bones and let the squirrels clean it up.  Was very happy to get everything I wanted on LS and move on to Origin :) Donated the few drops I had left there to the whatever it is for Don collection. Fear not though once I am done getting stuff for Origin I will be back on LS PERV'n along.  Still need to get sitting bones of "My X Wife" There.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,648
     :D 
  • TimStTimSt Posts: 1,240
    It takes me about 5 minutes to solo a poison elemental paragon with my mage. I lure him to the entrance, dart out, heal, cast meteor storm, dart in, target the mob, cast meteor storm again, target  mob, dart out, heal, repeat.

    It is a grind.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,648
    Sounds like as much fun as taking a mage to exodus.  You have no other toons with skills?
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    There are no poison eles in Atlantic deceit (fel)
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • AragornAragorn Posts: 241
    on my shard the spawn changes slight everyday and you will find one particular mob missing after server reboot. one day it is poison element one day it is fire another day it is spectral armor 
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,362
    Pawain said:
    You can take a tamer and back off slowly.  Then the ele will stay on the pet. Pet takes a lot of damage.  Then bring your Warrior in.  (Then a samp runs by and we die lol)

    Yup, wish we had that problem.  Our sampires pass em by but the core players call em out and we kick their butts.

    I thought these dynamic events were dynamic because the spawn changes for the amount of participants.  Are they supposed to @ Kyronix  Also please turn on Fel deceit, we need stuff to kill!

    Or you can keep them away from you using Energy fields, they break them so keep 2 up.
    I thought these dynamic events were dynamic because the spawn changes for the amount of participants.  Are they supposed to @Kyronix
    Indeed, that was my understanding too !!

    Especially, considering how Shards' Population levels can greatly vary....

    I mean, it is not possible to give the same spawn to Atlantic and, say, Oceania, right @Kyronix ?


  • SethSeth Posts: 1,353
    edited October 2020
    Mervyn said:
    There are no poison eles in Atlantic deceit (fel)
    There is no PE but alot of PK 
    We love bugs....
  • Arroth_ThaielArroth_Thaiel Posts: 738
    edited October 2020
    TimSt said:
    It takes me about 5 minutes to solo a poison elemental paragon with my mage. I lure him to the entrance, dart out, heal, cast meteor storm, dart in, target the mob, cast meteor storm again, target  mob, dart out, heal, repeat.

    It is a grind.
    I've tried this. Like Pawain has been saying, you can use Energy Field to corral them, but you have use multiple fields. PE paragons can be a real pain with a mage. However, they are much easier with a Poison Elemental slayer spellbook.
    -Arroth
  • PlayerSkillFTWPlayerSkillFTW Posts: 211
    edited October 2020
    Pawain said:
    I use a macer with a war hammer. Use Stagger and hit with crushing blow.
    So basically a Team of a tamer and a melee can run around and when they come to a paragon, invis both, put pet on it, then melee guy. The tamer can heal the melee guy and invis himself if needed.

    Also if two melee toons are running together they can also take on any single paragon and kill even faster.

    Teamwork.

    Maul actually works better than a Warhammer on single target here. Stagger+Double Strike is king in Deceit with a 100% Fire Wep.
    Najasaurus have absolutely zero problem tanking Paragon Poison Eles. A leveled Najasaurus with 80/80/45/100/60 resists is virtually immune to Paragon Poison Eles, since the PE deals 10% Physical/90% Poison damage, and the Najasaurus is immune to the Poison status as well.
    Only time my FWW+PB Najasaurus had problems last night, was when the teleporter to the third level of Deceit had 2 Paragon Rams, 2 Paragon Poison Eles, and a Paragon LL camping it. I had to embrace Honor, teleport down there, discord the LL and Rams, and have my Najasaurus tank as two Sampires beat on the Paragons.

    Tyrath said:
    Two Warriors slapping bandages on each other is still one of the most effective ways of dominating higher end content.

    Oh yeah, i know that. I used to duo Exodus and Blackthorn Captains with my Macer and a Fencer buddy. We would cross heal each other while the Fencer would use Pierce 3 times over 30 seconds to drop the mob to 0% Stamina, and then after that i'd keep Stagger up to reduce their SSI to -60%, neutering their melee damage output. Very few people did that though. When it comes to dexxers nowadays, Macers and Fencers are rare enough, let alone ones with Healing. My Fencer buddy hasn't played in awhile though :(
  • SmootSmoot Posts: 307
    my sampire with healing kills them.  still tough but can take them down.
    honor to get damage bonus
    confidence (heals thru poison)
    evasion
    i dont have much healing, only 70heal 70 anat, so the poison is still a pain, but its very doable.  could use greater cure potions too.
  • TabinTabin Posts: 30
    I enjoy the difficulty level.  It is absolutely easy to 1v1 any paragon using the right warrior template.  Both my sword bushido and mace paladin builds work.
  • Estel_RandirEstel_Randir Posts: 112
    edited October 2020
    They are one of the tougher paragons to be sure. My lowly board & sword Paladin "dexxer" with no bushido solos them all the time. 4 sec bandages, quick fingers on the keyboard, & running away for 15 sec or so to regroup does the trick.

    There are also two versions of the same paragons in this event. The normal (still harder than Ilshenar paragons), then there is a super version of them that simply are ridiculous. There seems to be some kind of paragon "power hour" that happens randomly to spawn these super paragons. I have seen paragons in this event cast long spells like flamestrike 2-3 times on top of each other with no delay & all this while they are running. Overall the paragons are a bit ridiculous.
  • usernameusername Posts: 138
    Wouldn't be such a problem if there was, ya know, incentive to kill them ;)
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  • SethSeth Posts: 1,353
    I find the Lich Lord Paragons are the toughest. I can Confidence and keep hacking away to eventually kill a Poison Ele Paragon if there are no other monsters around to leech life from. But the Lich Lord seems to have a higher HP, if I cannot whirlwind other monsters, I have to make sure I have space to run from this guy for at least one heal in between.
    We love bugs....
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,648
    Yup. I have come across some nasty LL.
  • SethSeth Posts: 1,353
    Pawain said:
    Yup. I have come across some nasty LL.

    And when I see both LL and PE inside a confined space, its time to run lol :D
    We love bugs....
  • AragornAragorn Posts: 241
    Seth said:
    Pawain said:
    Yup. I have come across some nasty LL.

    And when I see both LL and PE inside a confined space, its time to run lol :D

    confined space yes, but open space double paragons isn’t too bad.
  • SethSeth Posts: 1,353
    edited October 2020
    Aragorn said:
    Seth said:
    Pawain said:
    Yup. I have come across some nasty LL.

    And when I see both LL and PE inside a confined space, its time to run lol :D

    confined space yes, but open space double paragons isn’t too bad.

    As long as there is place to run or hide from attack, anything could also be fine... lol.

    Once I ran round the small Minax platform in shadowguard roof to heal from Virtuebane - I can run almost forever lol, it cannot kill me...

    Running is always the best defense. Doors are the number one unexpected killer. I hate doors. :D
    We love bugs....
  • AragornAragorn Posts: 241
    Seth said:
    Aragorn said:
    Seth said:
    Pawain said:
    Yup. I have come across some nasty LL.

    And when I see both LL and PE inside a confined space, its time to run lol :D

    confined space yes, but open space double paragons isn’t too bad.

    Doors are the number one unexpected killer. I hate doors. :D
    I hate the fact that if you are opening door via shortcut key you need to face the door even you are standing next to it. It's super annoying. 
  • SethSeth Posts: 1,353
    Aragorn said:
    I hate the fact that if you are opening door via shortcut key you need to face the door even you are standing next to it. It's super annoying. 

    Just to share, there is a shortcut key in EC to "Use nearest object". This can activate the door even when you are not facing it directly. However, this also open up nearby corpses that is near to the door.

    I agree they should program it such that it actually "open nearby door" without the need to face it.
    We love bugs....
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