Housing

Draden

So simple question, as a newly returned player with this new update do I need to toss my vendors and secure my home? I do believe that is the question many are asking as on the shard I play my have already done so. 

Fortis

read official note from devs... if you dont script in your house no problem at all even if there is 10 person who script in your shop...exept if they are using chest that require permission by you

Vlad

Fortis said:

read official note from devs... if you dont script in your house no problem at all even if there is 10 person who script in your shop...exept if they are using chest that require permission by you

Really?

According to the note, "If the house owner is absent, even if a malicious other person creates 60 EJ accounts at an Internet cafe and continues to report the absence macro for one month, the owner account will not be punished." I don't think it's written.

This note is not written on how to distinguish Scripter from malicious people.

Nor is it not written about whether it is possible to distinguish Scripter from a malicious person and just a victim.

...And will free secure in the shop be extinct?

Urge

Fortis said: read official note from devs... if you dont script in your house no problem at all even if there is 10 person who script in your shop...exept if they are using chest that require permission by you

Official note states:

"Specifically, if we come across a situation where a group of macroers are holed up in a house doing whatever it is they are doing (SKILL GAINS, crafting etc) or a recall group dropping off resources in chests at a specific house (or houses)"

Most skills don't require a chest to macro and this statement would absolutely open the door to griefing of a public home owner.

Fortis

this is really paranoia...do you really think they will ban owner of a paid account for stupid situation like this.... they for sure means like is you help the other account by lock down chest to trap animal to raise provoc.... things like this... not for someone casting magery nothing related to ownership they cant prove it and aren t that dumb and have no job in 6 months...

Vlad

My thoughts might be freak, and paranoia, but I came up with this situation in 30 seconds after looking at the note.

There are many ways to abuse this system to harass you.

Just start bot and report every day when everyone is sleeping.

There are countless humans with a personality like slime.

There are countless people who have not worked for six months.

And both of them are countless.

The note does not describe whether Slimy-Freak can be distinguished from victims and Scripters.

There is no information on whether there is an opportunity to excuse when suffering from such human beings.

Humans with the worst and dirty personality who actually do this dirty idea actually exist in this world.

That is my concern.

(This sentence is just a slight modification of the machine translation, but can you read it?)

Whisperer

Fortis said:

this is really paranoia...do you really think they will ban owner of a paid account for stupid situation like this.... they for sure means like is you help the other account by lock down chest to trap animal to raise provoc.... things like this... not for someone casting magery nothing related to ownership they cant prove it and aren t that dumb and have no job in 6 months...

Just so long as the magery trainer is actually there at the screen and not downstairs watch TV of course or asleep overnight. That IS causing harm and its illegal to be AFK macroing/scripting of course.

As I see it, if you feel the need to click on a 3rd party cheat program, you get the ban stick regardless of it being in your house, or mining. Cheating is cheating, no matter what it is and you deserve what u get.  You don't want to get banned? dont AFK macro or script.  Not hard to know its wrong

Fortis

im saying if your house is public and some stupid come there to script a skill you wont be ban for that devs aren t that stupid elt s go move on if you dont script you have 0 worry

ActionElly

I hope you guys are right! I found someone hidden in my house last night; they could have just been checking the house out or vendors.

However, the fact that they were hidden right next to a chest on my porch weirded me out because I logged in just to get rid of it after reading all the posts on here. I don't have anyone friended to that chest, but I guess I need to be careful as it would look very suspicious to anyone around.

I literally just started putting vendors out and now I think I better get rid of them and set the house to private.

Urge

Until we get solid solid clarification, this could open up some next level griefing for sure.

It's already been mentioned about skill macroing. The Nov 22 letter said accounts providing safe haven will be actioned. To me, this reads that someone could park endless untied EJ accounts in a public house with open doors macroing something as simple as magery that doesn't require a chest and get banned enough times that the home owner will also get banned. Then that public castle, luna house or house full of rares is up for grabs in 90 days.

It should only be accounts that have access-friend or co-own that could get a public homeowner in trouble.

Dasilva

and my question is how do you tell the diffeence between an illegal third party macro program or a player using the in game legal macro system of enhanced client? I use enhanced client and i can literally macro overnight using the enhanced in game client, its kind of a double jeapordy macroing is bannable in classic client but not in enhanced because enhanced has macro program built into it

Urge

Dasilva said:

and my question is how do you tell the diffeence between an illegal third party macro program or a player using the in game legal macro system of enhanced client? I use enhanced client and i can literally macro overnight using the enhanced in game client, its kind of a double jeapordy macroing is bannable in classic client but not in enhanced because enhanced has macro program built into it

Anything unattended will be actioned no matter what.

Dasilva

standing there at the bank with my in game macro going is not an illegal macro if it is then it should be specified because the client actually is set up to do macroing and there is no note under the macro button that says dont leave your computer while this is running

that gives me the ability to run the macro for quite a while with one keypress
not saying i actually do it just saying it is easily done in enhanced client

to the OP it boils down to how much do you like your account? I have already turned all my houses private on all my wife and i's accounts

Pawain

The Terms of Service say you must play the game attended.   You have a better change of getting a warning for that than your houses do of being notified.

Do you have groups of players skilling at your house or recalling in and out and dropping resources in a chest?  My houses are staying public. 

You have nothing to worry about on a dead shard.

Dragoon

For everyone exchanging back and forth, you're losing sight of the original question.

This person is not asking what happens to afk macroers.
This person is not asking what happens to EJ users.
This person is not asking what happens to scripters.
This person is not asking what happens to third party users.

There was a front page post about taking action against "safe harbor" houses, where macroers go to SOMEONE ELSE'S house to drop off resources or train skills. It the other players are using illegal activities and do not care about getting their accounts banned, they can utilize the report system from another account to report the EJ accounts they created currently in SOMEONE ELSE'S house. The accounts don't need to have an actual relation. If the home owner gets actioned and banned from this griefing, the devs have basically accidentally opened up a way to get an innocent account banned (if they have public house access) and utilize this to bring a house down that they want to take.

To answer the question initially asked, you would most likely be able to appeal a ban if it was 100% without your knowledge (you either didn't know what they were doing or they were doing things while you weren't even awake). However, without a mod or dev clarifying this, you have every reason to be cautious. This wouldn't have been a problem if it wasn't for EJ accounts, and by having EJ accounts, the devs added a massive complication to an old rule. People wouldn't have gone through the effort before, since you needed credit card info and a whole load of investment to create dummy bannable accounts, but with EJ you now have an open door for griefing with little effort and a much harder ability to trace the source problem-starter.

Personally, if I magically get a ban at my house, you can bet that I'll be spamming someone's inbox with appeals. I'm not going to change my house to private and shut down my vendors because of this nonsense. I'm thinking the devs/mods will be able to figure out the difference between griefing accounts and actual afk macroers. It's just a shame they don't work harder on permanent solutions to keep them out of the game. Force EJ users to have a cellular two-step authentication every log-in to restrict them to one account, and you'll shut that crap down ASAP.

Pawain

 I'm thinking the devs/mods will be able to figure out the difference between griefing accounts and actual afk macroers. 

The GMs are the ones that will enforce this.  That is who we hope will make the correct decisions.
Don't you think the actual cheaters will also do this: Personally, if I magically get a ban at my house, you can bet that I'll be spamming someone's inbox with appeals. 

I'm glad that the GMs I have seen are knowledgeable and have been around a long time. 

Mesanna should not have announced this enforcement method.  The banned over 200 accounts last month.  The posters who are the most worried did not get an warning email.

Dragoon

The devs still can assist with better banning methods, so they definitely can have involvement here. GMs would be the UO mods. Both can put in two cents to figure out what's going on with the macroing.

As far as appealing goes, it will get pretty quickly obvious if a player is complaining about bots in the appeal, and I'm assuming at some point there would be a one-on-one with some member of staff. I feel like they should be taking MAC/IP info down too to help with this (Yes, I know both can be masked but it makes it a hell of a lot harder to throw a hundred bots out).