Returning Player - mage questions

Vartuk

Returning after 22 years and am very lost.  Starting over on Atlantic and would like to build a mage that can handle a mix of pvp and pvm. Does anyone have a suggested template?  Many thanks.

Arnold7

My mage with a crystaline ring and a wizard’s curio has 120 magery and eval intel, 100 meditation and resist spells, 120 spellweaving, 100 spirit speak and 80 necro. He does quite well at pvm.  I don’t do pvp, but if I swapped out spellweaving for wrestling and gave him a mage weapon he might do well there.  Based on what I have read pvp is pretty specialized now, so the same character might not be able to do both well.

Urge

Mage for pvm is based on spell damage inc. Mage for pvp is capped at a low spell damage inc with a heavy focus on secondary skills and +skill items. This gets super expensive for both areas especially for a returning player. 

I will always recommend a tamer variation for returning players in pvm. You can skim by pretty cheap and still reap the rewards of doing high level content. 

Cookie

Vartuk said:

Returning after 22 years and am very lost.  Starting over on Atlantic and would like to build a mage that can handle a mix of pvp and pvm. Does anyone have a suggested template?  Many thanks.

As they have all said so far.
Mage in pvm requires huge mana (200+), and huge SDI (150 odd) - both of these are not necessarily used in pvp.
Good pvm mage template can be 6x120 - Mage+eval Int+wrestle+resist+meditation+spellweaving=720 skillpoints.
The high SDI and mana lend to a good Thunderstorm, and Word of Death.
With a secondary good pvp suit, this option is playable in pvm and pvp.
This is Alea Iacta Est.

Build yourself a pvm mage first, this is easier.
A Mystic Mage is also a good pvm option, although I find the RC quite unwieldy and slow. If you go this way, consider gargoyle, because he can fly and drop RC.
This is Cerviel.

Then build a 2nd specialised pvp suit which drops SDI and builds in survival methods - damage eaters, hp regens, mana regens, dci, hci, even some ssi, enhance potions, +skills if you can, to achieve more skills.
If you make heavy use of wrestle disarm, you can get by ok, you are not necessarily going to win 1v1, but you can be helpful in a team, and you will have some survivability.
This second part can be achieved without adjusting your stats, they can stay Dex low, and Int high.

Then if you want to go further into pvp, you have to start dropping pvm abilities - my pvp mages cannot pvm really.

You have variations.

Parry is almost an essential for pvp - but if you are brave, you can go without it.
HP 150 is essential. Dex 84 is essential (you can chose to live on potions for these). Then of course you need mana - so for any Parry builds, you have to drop your mana quite heavily. meaning you will have mana issues, this is inevitable.
Ways to get round that include, mana regens on the suit, soul charge 30 on the event reward shield, mana draughts, and the +skills on that are nice also - also, the reactive paralyse on the event reward shield works in tandem with parry.

If you are going with Parry - which will nullify you for pvm, you can use Mystic templates with it, you usually need huge +skill. (up to 120).
Mage+Parry+Mystic+Eval Int+Focus+Resist+Wrestle = 840 skillpoints - notice Med is dropped. You are looking for extra skillpoints here which you can get off talisman, jewels, shield + other very highly priced event rewards. I'm not a fan of this, the extra +skills weaken my defensive suit too much, and jewels wear out like you cannot believe. These templates often go for non medable armour, and use refinements which is helpful against the amount of fire spells that are dropped on you. I'm also not a fan of non medable armour on mages - but it is the meta. To me, this is very high cost, high maintenance, and not fun. They go human for JOAT SW+20.

If you chose not to go with Parry, you can open up some more fun options, my favourite right now is;
Mage+Eval Int+Scribe+Alchy+Resist+Wrestle+30SW+30Chiv+30 Parry= 770 skillpoints.
I rely heavily on disarm, but apart from that, I have a lot of mana for casting and playability, and a lot of good options including potion usage. I can stay elf with this template, and benefit from higher mana, and better stealth detection.
Going pure mage such as the above, opens up maximum pvp SDI by using 150Int, having no Parry or related Mage skill over 30, +10SDI from Scribe, so you take your pvp SDI up from 20 to 35 (compared to 150 SDI on a pvm mage build), which is noticeable, and nice. But your defences are much weaker.
This is Wraith.

Cookie

Having reviewed the above post of mine, a thought for the Devs, if you could be much more generous with SDI on suits - ie much more, without compromising the other stats - Mages could be used much more flexibly in pvp, and pvm, without having to change everything around massively.
I'm almost suggesting the Property cost of SDI is reduced heavily, so much more can be added in.

It would make no difference to pvp, because SDI is hard capped there anyway, it would allow pvp mages, to pvm a lot more. The objective would be to help close the gap from 35 SDI to 150 SDI for pvm purposes.
{Mages are not OP in pvm in the slightest, so I cannot see this affecting any other pvm template balance}

@Kyronix ^

Zylo

Vartuk said:

Returning after 22 years and am very lost.  Starting over on Atlantic and would like to build a mage that can handle a mix of pvp and pvm. Does anyone have a suggested template?  Many thanks.

A little late but maybe still helpful to the OP or any other returning "Mage". I have always played a Mage main since 1998 off and on. Hopefully I can offer some helpful insight.

PvP as a Mage can be.. no.. IS hard.

You need some type of defensive ability. Many pure mages go with 100 ANATOMY / 120 EVALUATE INTELLIGENCE to get an effective 120 evasion and free 20 skill points.

Often times you will see "Tank mages" running a weapon skill which requires 120 skill points for effective evasion.. If you want to use special abilities, you'll need to add at least 90 TACTICS.

Some mages run Parry which requires 85 Dexterity for max effectiveness... 85 is what you need after your enemy debuffs you in PvP... so recommended higher than 85 to guard against debuff. Good luck fitting all that on a "Mage" template... It soon starts to look like a warrior template sometimes... I do it and many others do also but this path is difficult!

PURE MAGE. I recommend building this first if you want to do PvM and PvP.

100 Inscription
120 Wrestling / 100 Anatomy*
120 Evaluate Intelligence
120 Magery
120 Resist Spells
120 Meditation
20 - 40 Leftover Points (Focus or Other Skill)

This is an easy to build / train mage template that will be versatile and effective in both PvM and PvP.

*If you choose 100 ANATOMY, you will have 40 skill points leftover which you can put towards ANY skill you want, I recommend FOCUS as you will gain Stamina / Mana regen, useful for PvM / PvP.

If you are doing more PvM, I recommend 100 ANATOMY as having more FOCUS / Mana / Stamina regen will be useful for sustain / farming / encounters.

If you are doing more PvP, I recommend 120 WRESTLING as you will gain Disarm / Paralyzing Blow abilities which are very useful in PvP. This will use up your mana faster.

*Note: 100 Anatomy is Free. A 120 Wrestling Powerscroll can be expensive! SAME evasion for a mage and I'm never trying to stand toe to toe vs Greater Dragons and punch / disarm them in PvM!

With Wrestling, that leaves you with 20 skill points leftover. If you are a human, you already have a "Jack of All Trades", giving you 20 in every skill already, however, if you put those 20 into "Focus", you will have 20 real skill and then if you add items with +Skill, you can increase that above 20 for Mana / Stamina regen.

If you want to go TANK Mage and use a weapon or add Parrying, you'll have to adjust your stats A LOT to get 85 Dexterity and this is a devastating hit to your health / strength and mana pool... You'll also have to find a way to squeeze TACTICS in if you want special weapon abilities, most likely dropping meditation and relying on high Mana regen items... It's a much more difficult and expensive template to build and use all around.

If you choose Wrestling, you do NOT need Tactics for the special abilities and you can still hold a spell book, giving you bonuses.

Another option is to drop 120 Meditation, run High Mana Regen items and choose any other skill you want such as Hiding which can be very useful. This is useful in both PvM and PvP situation also so there is some customizability which how you play and how you want to build your "Mage" template.

A great spellbook to use is a "Scrappers Compendium". If you make a friend in game, I'm sure they will give you one. I have a collection I have for new / returning players if they need.

Power Scrolls can be expensive. Another easy, CHEAP option for a PvM Pure Mage Template can be:

110 Magery
110 Evaluate Intelligence
100 Anatomy
100 Inscription
100 Meditation
100 Resisting Spells
100 Focus / Hiding / Your Choice

This gives you 7 useful skills instead of 6, you still have high Evasion and Magery ability.

It's Much Cheaper and faster to build. This still gives you a VERY effective template you can max out soon and enjoy playing the game with!

I'm also on Atlantic, if you'd like to meet up in game let me know! I can help you with some items and give you a Scrappers Compendium or anything else to help you get going again.

Welcome Back!