show red players some love

It's time to change what being a murderer actually means as it stands currently player killing in an outdated concept in UO and not much can change that. I get there are arguments that being 'red' should have negative aspects attached to it but really in this version of UO it doesn't mean anything with royal pardons players can go blue at any time so restricting what red characters can do no longer makes sense.

I propose you simply make being red a felucca only thing, Let red's into trammel facets and appear as blues (i see this done on freeshards) and when they return to felucca they will be red like normal. This will open up town buff to red players and make the game balanced.

Also remove Royal Pardon's from the game and only keep the forged pardon's. Seeing a Red should be a warning that you will probably die in Felucca. It ruins the game when you do a champion spawn and get raided by blue's only to have them wait for an opportune moment to kill you and steal your spawn only to use a pardon to go blue again. A characters color should be a strong indicator of a players intent but with everyone blue you have no idea what their intent is until they show it and as a consequence its the friendly blue players that suffer as they have to wait for the other player to act before they can react appropriately and in this case puts them at a disadvantage.

  • Let red's into trammel facets so players are not forced to be blue
  • remove royal pardon's because red's should remain red and if they really don't want to they can buy Forged Pardon's off treasure hunters which will increase in value making returning to blue a more expensive process.

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Comments

  • FatFat Posts: 97
    Let reds kill players in tram
  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    A characters color should be a strong indicator of a players intent but with everyone blue you have no idea what their intent is until they show it and as a consequence its the friendly blue players that suffer as they have to wait for the other player to act before they can react appropriately and in this case puts them at a disadvantage.

    Yes reds who show their true colours are penalised..

    The system is backwards, the blues do the game mechanic trollng yet get the benefits.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    What would make things fair would be to just reduce the city buff to last only like an hour and make it purgeable.
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    NO You went RED for a reason, now live with it and nothing is stopping you from logging on any other char on your account.  I thought FEL was the greatest.
  • PodolakPodolak Posts: 13
    I like a lot of what you are saying.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion and some will come in and say you accepted the consequences when you became (or decided to stay) red.  However, my opinion more closely matches yours.  The FC1 town buff is integral to many suits and I do believe that there should be away for reds to get the buff.  My thought was always to put the town stones in Felucca but there are benefits if reds could go to Trammel.  There will be those of the opposite opinion and they are allowed to have that.  Just throwing my +1 in the ring as this being something I'd enjoy considered.

  • Dot_WarnerDot_Warner Posts: 233
    There has already been talk of incorporating town buffs into VvV. Just hold the dev's feet to the fire.

  • I propose you simply make being red a felucca only thing, Let red's into trammel facets and appear as blues (i see this done on freeshards) and when they return to felucca they will be red like normal. This will open up town buff to red players and make the game balanced.
    Yes please.
  • TastyTreatsTastyTreats Posts: 65
    edited June 2018
    Bilbo said:
    NO You went RED for a reason, now live with it and nothing is stopping you from logging on any other char on your account.  I thought FEL was the greatest.
    But I'm not red. I am blue and once I go red I use a royal pardon to go blue again instantly.

    How is that a fair and balanced system?

    Adding town buff's to VvV would help but would not eliminate all the problems at this stage of the game there is really no point into not allowing red's into trammel and royal pardons should be a once time reprieve not an endless ticket to go blue.

    The red's are already going to trammel thanks to royal pardons so what exactly is the argument against this if they are already there? Either way those same characters are in trammel atleast my way they keep their red status while in Felucca. The way it is now just hurts the random player.

    Not to mention the current lack of Red's has really hurt the Justice virtue.

  • MervynMervyn Posts: 2,208
    I know EJ accounts can’t gain virtues but can you still gain justice for killing a red that is on an EJ account? 
    I tell you the truth, tis better to do 10 damage on the right target than 100 damage on the wrong target.

    Breaking in the young since 2002


  • crunchnastycrunchnasty Posts: 241
    Royal Pardons are a slap in the face to everyone else.
  • SyncrosSyncros Posts: 116
    While its nice to have the 2 types of pardons they need to be given a much longer timer between uses.   I have no problems with reds in Trammel facets either as long as others cant heal/res them unless red themselves and of course either side cant attack each other.    But that also brings up the current PvP system which is subpar to say the least.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    Bilbo said:
    NO You went RED for a reason, now live with it and nothing is stopping you from logging on any other char on your account.  I thought FEL was the greatest.
    But I'm not red. I am blue and once I go red I use a royal pardon to go blue again instantly.

    How is that a fair and balanced system?

    Adding town buff's to VvV would help but would not eliminate all the problems at this stage of the game there is really no point into not allowing red's into trammel and royal pardons should be a once time reprieve not an endless ticket to go blue.

    The red's are already going to trammel thanks to royal pardons so what exactly is the argument against this if they are already there? Either way those same characters are in trammel atleast my way they keep their red status while in Felucca. The way it is now just hurts the random player.

    Not to mention the current lack of Red's has really hurt the Justice virtue.

    Life aint fair and balanced, deal with it.  Wasn't there a thread about turning all of UO into a Con. PvP and boy did the PvPers go off on that idea and now you want to let REDs into Tram, now that is funny.
  • Bilbo said:
    Bilbo said:
    NO You went RED for a reason, now live with it and nothing is stopping you from logging on any other char on your account.  I thought FEL was the greatest.
    But I'm not red. I am blue and once I go red I use a royal pardon to go blue again instantly.

    How is that a fair and balanced system?

    Adding town buff's to VvV would help but would not eliminate all the problems at this stage of the game there is really no point into not allowing red's into trammel and royal pardons should be a once time reprieve not an endless ticket to go blue.

    The red's are already going to trammel thanks to royal pardons so what exactly is the argument against this if they are already there? Either way those same characters are in trammel atleast my way they keep their red status while in Felucca. The way it is now just hurts the random player.

    Not to mention the current lack of Red's has really hurt the Justice virtue.

    Life aint fair and balanced, deal with it.  Wasn't there a thread about turning all of UO into a Con. PvP and boy did the PvPers go off on that idea and now you want to let REDs into Tram, now that is funny.
    You have no argument against it and it's not me that this system is hurting. It's the innocent blue players that get caught in the middle of players abusing the system to stay blue.

    Your posting history shows you are nothing more then a troll on these boards so I'd appreciate it if you could add something of substance to this discussion or please just show yourself out.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    LMAO  Just because I do not agree with you then I am a TROLL and the REDs are using the system how it was designed so how does that mean they are abusing the system.  You want to let REDs into TRAM and I said NO, use pardons or better yet do not turn RED problem solved.  REDs belong in FEL.
  • MerusMerus Posts: 389
    Mervyn said:
    I know EJ accounts can’t gain virtues but can you still gain justice for killing a red that is on an EJ account? 
    Yes
  • DukarloDukarlo Posts: 50
    A player is most likely to be pked by a blue in what is called "uo" nowadays. The only difference between a red and a blue is that the blues ate pardons. And because the blue ate a pardon he is entitled to the virtue system as well as hiding out in trammel with no repercussions. The justice and reputation systems have been babied down. For what reason I haven't a clue.
  • Bilbo said:
    LMAO  Just because I do not agree with you then I am a TROLL and the REDs are using the system how it was designed so how does that mean they are abusing the system.  You want to let REDs into TRAM and I said NO, use pardons or better yet do not turn RED problem solved.  REDs belong in FEL.
    See you don't even understand what the discussion is about your just blindly making statements without any knowledge of game mechanics.

  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    Bilbo said:
    LMAO  Just because I do not agree with you then I am a TROLL and the REDs are using the system how it was designed so how does that mean they are abusing the system.  You want to let REDs into TRAM and I said NO, use pardons or better yet do not turn RED problem solved.  REDs belong in FEL.
    See you don't even understand what the discussion is about your just blindly making statements without any knowledge of game mechanics.

    It is about YOU wanting to go RED in FEL and still be able to go to TRAM as a BLUE. Try again, sorry the truth hurts.
  • PinkertonPinkerton Posts: 105
    Just remove "red" from the game, it means absolutely nothing anymore anyway.

    I get raided by blues, they kill me and my mates and go red.

    The next day they come to raid us again and they are all blue again.

    It is a stupid, pointless system.

    Give out titles instead for X,Y,Z number of counts, that's all being red really amounts to anyway.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    Pinkerton said:
    Just remove "red" from the game, it means absolutely nothing anymore anyway.

    I get raided by blues, they kill me and my mates and go red.

    The next day they come to raid us again and they are all blue again.

    It is a stupid, pointless system.

    Give out titles instead for X,Y,Z number of counts, that's all being red really amounts to anyway.
    Go all the way and just remove players killing each other.
  • King_GregKing_Greg Posts: 229
    +Town Buffs

    Really all I care about. 

  • Bilbo said:
    Bilbo said:
    LMAO  Just because I do not agree with you then I am a TROLL and the REDs are using the system how it was designed so how does that mean they are abusing the system.  You want to let REDs into TRAM and I said NO, use pardons or better yet do not turn RED problem solved.  REDs belong in FEL.
    See you don't even understand what the discussion is about your just blindly making statements without any knowledge of game mechanics.

    It is about YOU wanting to go RED in FEL and still be able to go to TRAM as a BLUE. Try again, sorry the truth hurts.
    Like I said you don't understand the conversation so please stop replying. I am done talking with you as you have zero knowledge of what this is about so feel free to stop trolling and just leave the conversation because you have nothing to add to it.
  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    Bilbo said:
    Bilbo said:
    LMAO  Just because I do not agree with you then I am a TROLL and the REDs are using the system how it was designed so how does that mean they are abusing the system.  You want to let REDs into TRAM and I said NO, use pardons or better yet do not turn RED problem solved.  REDs belong in FEL.
    See you don't even understand what the discussion is about your just blindly making statements without any knowledge of game mechanics.

    It is about YOU wanting to go RED in FEL and still be able to go to TRAM as a BLUE. Try again, sorry the truth hurts.
    Like I said you don't understand the conversation so please stop replying. I am done talking with you as you have zero knowledge of what this is about so feel free to stop trolling and just leave the conversation because you have nothing to add to it.
    The problem is I do understand what you want, what the real problem is that you try to make this about something else when it is all about you and what you want but I guess you think every body was born yesterday and can't read between the lines.  You just hate it because I have no problem telling the truth and you do not like it.
  • BoBoBoBo Posts: 21

    A red wants to go to trammel, what the?   Option 1 Bo thinks you could log on your other character.  ya got what 6 others?  and you want to get rid of royal forged pardons?  Seriously why not stock up on the pardons and when you go red, guess what you can do? Option 2  eat  a royal pardon and be blue..  Than you can goto tram and live happily ever after. 

     

  • BoBo said:

    A red wants to go to trammel, what the?   Option 1 Bo thinks you could log on your other character.  ya got what 6 others?  and you want to get rid of royal forged pardons?  Seriously why not stock up on the pardons and when you go red, guess what you can do? Option 2  eat  a royal pardon and be blue..  Than you can goto tram and live happily ever after. 

     

    I want reds to stay red. I don't care if my red ever goes to trammel but 'reds' are already going to trammel thanks to pardon's which is far worse for the game then actually just allowing red's to go into trammel normally while still retaining their murderer status in Felucca.

    Royal Pardon's need to go because you can't keep killing innocent blue players and stay blue. Players that are unfamiliar with your character need to know by the color of your name what to expect when they encounter you otherwise the other player is at a severe disadvantage. Royal Pardons break game mechanics.
  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 954
    But
    You have never been able to trust that a blue you meet in Fel is going to be friendly, they may be on 3 or 4 counts. The only real difference is you don't see them hanging around Luna macroing counts now.  Anyone who trusted that a blue met in fel wouldn't attack was highly foolish.
  • But
    You have never been able to trust that a blue you meet in Fel is going to be friendly, they may be on 3 or 4 counts. The only real difference is you don't see them hanging around Luna macroing counts now.  Anyone who trusted that a blue met in fel wouldn't attack was highly foolish.
    That's true but if they go red they still have to work those counts off to go blue which takes at minimum 40 hours. And if you go up to 7-10 murder counts your almost guaranteed to stay red as you will continue to take more counts before you can successfully macro them off.

    Let's hear what benefits Royal Pardon's actually add to the game?
  • So there used to be a time when being a murderer was bragging rights and people would compare murderer counts back in the bounty days. to me the thing that has killed reds is the buffs they cant get because of being red and taking away things like bounty boards so now there is no reason to be red other then to be a protector at a champ spawn throwing fields. Royal pardons and forged pardons make waiting off murder counts trival so literally they have given no reason for a red to be red anymore accept for us few that still feel pride in our kill counts that we worked and fought so hard for over the years.
  • PinkertonPinkerton Posts: 105
    Sure let reds in Tram, and let them be attackable in Tram.  Allow them to try and defend themselves, of course.  But, hey, everyone is griping for more PvP.

    And all we hear is Fel players crying "Risk vs Reward"

    So sure, come to Tram all you want, but being red means you are freely attackable by anyone at any time.


  • CetricCetric Posts: 152
    I really like that red in feel blue in tram concept, so you can go both places.  The only reason all of my chars aren't red is town buff.  It's actually a large hindrance not being able to attack blues without having to buy pardons when ur fighting a guild at a spawn, and half are orange for vvv, and the other half is blue trying to finish the spawn.  Or other cases at fights where blues just roam around waiting for a single player to go grey because they know the blues won't attack them.
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