Possible Suggestions

I am sure this has already been suggested, but I have not logged in here since the IDOC change, which has worked out spectacular.

Devs, would it be possible to block EJ from both Vendor Searching and using General Chat? I think we all know of the pitfalls of them using general chat. But I would also like to point out that people are likely using scripts to scour vendor search with EJ accounts. I have noticed a lack of several items on vendor search ever since EJ came out. These are not newbie items.... but certain rare items that have never appeared again.

Someone told me once that the "elites" were making 1p a week off of vendor search alone, and I think that is the case. They are using them to search all 30-32 shards at once and taking any valuable items away from players. Please consider helping out in this. I know it is a big step to block them from using vendor search, but I think the rewards justify the means for players who actually play the game. Returning "real players"..... not bots abusing EJ, will already not know what VS is and will go around looking at vendors anyway. Perhaps starting them off at Luna bank would help out a ton, as most of the actual new "returning" players never even make it to Luna before quitting. They do not know what Luna is; they sure do not know what vendor search is. They login, open their backpack, paperdoll, and skill tab, and options to set their macro.... and that is about the end of it. They see no players in Haven/Britain and often unsubscribe thinking not many are playing. Please start EJ accounts at Luna bank. Please stop the "elites" abusing EJ from using general chat to spam and VS to rob everyone (they are multi-boxing multi-searching all production shards at once.)

Thank you so much for the IDOC changes; while they are still using barrel punching "programs" and multi-boxing that and doing the same for house placement...... I am actually getting server births and I my wife got a tinker legs today. So thank you for changing the IDOCs, it has helped greatly.

Comments

  • poppspopps Posts: 2,160
    Polaris said:
    I am sure this has already been suggested, but I have not logged in here since the IDOC change, which has worked out spectacular.

    Devs, would it be possible to block EJ from both Vendor Searching and using General Chat? I think we all know of the pitfalls of them using general chat. But I would also like to point out that people are likely using scripts to scour vendor search with EJ accounts. I have noticed a lack of several items on vendor search ever since EJ came out. These are not newbie items.... but certain rare items that have never appeared again.

    Someone told me once that the "elites" were making 1p a week off of vendor search alone, and I think that is the case. They are using them to search all 30-32 shards at once and taking any valuable items away from players. Please consider helping out in this. I know it is a big step to block them from using vendor search, but I think the rewards justify the means for players who actually play the game. Returning "real players"..... not bots abusing EJ, will already not know what VS is and will go around looking at vendors anyway. Perhaps starting them off at Luna bank would help out a ton, as most of the actual new "returning" players never even make it to Luna before quitting. They do not know what Luna is; they sure do not know what vendor search is. They login, open their backpack, paperdoll, and skill tab, and options to set their macro.... and that is about the end of it. They see no players in Haven/Britain and often unsubscribe thinking not many are playing. Please start EJ accounts at Luna bank. Please stop the "elites" abusing EJ from using general chat to spam and VS to rob everyone (they are multi-boxing multi-searching all production shards at once.)

    Thank you so much for the IDOC changes; while they are still using barrel punching "programs" and multi-boxing that and doing the same for house placement...... I am actually getting server births and I my wife got a tinker legs today. So thank you for changing the IDOCs, it has helped greatly.
    I do not think it a good idea.

    The purpose of Endless Journey accounts is that of trying Ultima Online as much as possible to then decide to stay and move to a subscribed account.

    Vendor Search and General Chat, especially for a New player, are fundamental parts to get started in Ultima Online be it to seek help or find equipment to play.

    The real problem here, to my opinion, is the ability of players to run scripts.

    These RMT people, I imagine, do not sit at the keyboard spending their time to spam their Web sites in Chat.... I guess that they use scripts.

    Well, then it is about time that in Ultima Online this scripting ability goes away for good.

    It would fix soooooooooooo many issues and problems from farming to RMT spamming and so forth.

    Personally, I would be happy NOT to see any new content nor anything at all in Ultima Online for even 6 months IF the Developers would just spend 100% of their time to find a way to get rid of scripting in Ultime Online for good.

    It would solve so many issues and problems with this game that it would be a dream come true, to my opinion.
  • dapHdapH Posts: 5
    popps said:

    Vendor Search and General Chat, especially for a New player, are fundamental parts to get started in Ultima Online be it to seek help or find equipment to play.
    Yes, this I experienced myself. In these times, you could run crying for a long time to find anyone who can help you. Especially with the limited search option on this forum.

  • RadstRadst Posts: 45
    Yes, it's time that EJ privilege was reviewed. Splint weps in PVP is a HUGE market, and people are using EJ bots to farm these. Make a new char and equip noob armors/weps, and bots are ready to work in 3 minutes. It's insane.

    There's this guy from China (lives in China, speaks no English) started playing UO when EJ came out, and someone taught him how to script. And in a few months he was buying all blaze cu's and moongate shops and all top stuff and started selling gold on atlantic discord. INSANE.

    All these because EJ is expendable at no risks to their main acct. You ban the EJ bots today, and they create a few more tomorrow.

    To create EJ, you still need to sign up using your main acct. If you can link merits to their main accts, this might discourage their activities.

    Still, you need to start limiting how EJ can perform certain tasks (without hurting legit EJ support chars). Nerfing EJ's ability to do Traders Quest was a good one, for example (Pub107).
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,160
    edited November 2020
    Radst said:
    Yes, it's time that EJ privilege was reviewed. Splint weps in PVP is a HUGE market, and people are using EJ bots to farm these. Make a new char and equip noob armors/weps, and bots are ready to work in 3 minutes. It's insane.

    There's this guy from China (lives in China, speaks no English) started playing UO when EJ came out, and someone taught him how to script. And in a few months he was buying all blaze cu's and moongate shops and all top stuff and started selling gold on atlantic discord. INSANE.

    All these because EJ is expendable at no risks to their main acct. You ban the EJ bots today, and they create a few more tomorrow.

    To create EJ, you still need to sign up using your main acct. If you can link merits to their main accts, this might discourage their activities.

    Still, you need to start limiting how EJ can perform certain tasks (without hurting legit EJ support chars). Nerfing EJ's ability to do Traders Quest was a good one, for example (Pub107).
    I will say it again.... the problem is NOT Endless Journey accounts, the problem is the ability of Ultima Online players to SCRIPT.

    I honestly do not understand why we keep lamenting issues that ALL root to AFK scripting but we do not see this being addressed and stopped for good.

    The problem is SCRIPTING, S-C-R-I-P-T-I-N-G !!!

    So, instead of patching here and patching there, what would need to be done is to find a way to STOP players' ability to script using Third Party non authorized Scripts.

    I said it already and will repeat it here.... I would be IMMENSELY happy if the Developers stopped any work related to Ultima Online such as new content, fixing of bugs EVERYTHING, and started working to find a way to stop FOR GOOD the ability for UO players to use non-authorized scripts to farm, spam in Chat RMT web site and so forth.

    Even for months upon months, even for 6 months as long as they come up with a solution what would get rid of scripting in Ultima Online for good I would be immensely happy to see ZERO new content, ZERO bugs fixed, nothing else but working to find a final solution to stop scripting in Ultima Online.

    It would solve sooooo many issues and problems which players have been lamenting for ever in Ultima Online so, why not putting this as the very # 1 priority to work on ?
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    edited November 2020
    popps said:
    I do not think it a good idea.

    The purpose of Endless Journey accounts is that of trying Ultima Online as much as possible to then decide to stay and move to a subscribed account.

    Vendor Search and General Chat, especially for a New player, are fundamental parts to get started in Ultima Online be it to seek help or find equipment to play.

    The real problem here, to my opinion, is the ability of players to run scripts.

    These RMT people, I imagine, do not sit at the keyboard spending their time to spam their Web sites in Chat.... I guess that they use scripts.

    Well, then it is about time that in Ultima Online this scripting ability goes away for good.

    It would fix soooooooooooo many issues and problems from farming to RMT spamming and so forth.

    Personally, I would be happy NOT to see any new content nor anything at all in Ultima Online for even 6 months IF the Developers would just spend 100% of their time to find a way to get rid of scripting in Ultime Online for good.

    It would solve so many issues and problems with this game that it would be a dream come true, to my opinion.
    This is the type of thinking that enables scripting. You have been around for decades Popps, I think you would understand that better than anyone, no? 

    Scripters use VPNs and a few of them have 10 different computers set up with different settings. (When you access websites and everything, it leaves a fingerprint of your PC details, software, windows, IP, and much more.) They can identify people by those PC settings. But by using VPNs in conjunction with certain software, they can replicate any type of "appearance" they want. If they wanted it to say they were using Windows 95, North Pole, and IP address 1000000001 it would. That it why it is virtually impossible to ban those guys.

    They are getting banned however. The huge 1000p+ castle that fell by fel Cove on Drachenfels 6 months ago is proof. Endless journey however, gives them an endless supply of replicatable bots that they can use. They do not even create bots.... they can use programs to recreate bots with different names every few days. They can use programs to sign up to email and Broadsword every few days with a brand new email and create brand new EJ accounts, every few days. EJ does not have to be tied to any other account, only an email which a bot can create in 20 seconds. Why do you think every site has those pictures like "Check all Crosswalks" or "Check Every Picture with Cars." The programs can do all of that outside of UO. Ultima Online, nor any game, has any way to detect outside programs aside from seeing a repetative string, such as when a bot gets stuck. As far as I know, the only thing they have to really do is transfer gold between accounts.

    Leaving EJ with gen chat privileges and VS harms the actual player base. Every item that people collect is getting swiped up by bots within hours after being placed on VS. Anything that meets their "threshold to buy" is getting bought and repriced. They should not be able to use 32 chars and vendor search every shard with replicatable accounts / bots over and over.

    The only way I can think of to fix this would be to stop EJ from using vendor search. Stopping them from gen chat would fix the gold sellers.... but I do not care so much about that spamming as I do about the vendor searching.

    Devs listened to me about the IDOC changes, and absolutely everyone is eternally grateful. The change was miraculous. Whoever came up with the barrel idea on top of what I was floating around was a genius. Please try to find a way to stop the abuse of EJ accounts though. Making an EJ only chat (that normal vet players could join too) is not a bad idea. That would funnel all the EJ players in together and they could easily make guilds and join up. They would not have to hear the toxic 12 year old chat going on on Atlantic gen chat.... which causes a ton of people to quit the game actually, trust me. Give them an EJ only chat and start every EJ char in Luna so that they automatically know where the people and vendors are. Most returning players never even find out what Luna is. A ton of guilds who want to recruit will go to the EJ chat and recruit people, trust me. It would likely be a hundred times better than general chat itself. There is no real need for EJ chars to vendor search. They are fighting mongbats and earth eles. They don't have nor should need an item that costs 5m.... little lone 175m or 5.5p. Stopping them from using gen. chat and VS would greatly help out the real players that have been playing for 10 or 15 years and want to play and are planning on staying.

    Apparant Cons:  Gold sellers will just go to the EJ forum to sell gold. This is a major win still.... they will lose a ton of their funding. The people trashing Mesanna would lose their funding. The Devs could even put out their own spam message on the EJ chat every 15 minutes that says "Buying Gold from those Websites is Illegal and You Will Be Banned. You also risk compromising your data and putting your PC at risk."

    Pros: 1) No more gold sellers on general chat. No more "anonymous" people on general chat bashing Devs, players, and Mesanna. Everyone on general chat should be tied to a paying account so that they are ban-able. 2) Actual new returning players will start in Luna. They will see people actually instead of someone selling gold on a chat. 3) EJ players won't be overwhelmed by prices so quickly. It will give them a more authentic Ultima Online feel and nostalgia. 4) There will be a new EJ chat channel. This will encourage groups, guilds, friends, and veteran players helping them out. 5) This will block scripts from searching vendor search. Vendor search will be a lot more efficient I bet! Meaning it will work better. 6) Veteran players will be able to collect the items they are after for once, instead of people buying / repricing items. 7) EJ accounts will be able to find vendors selling "lower tiered armor" that someone else is not buying up.

    I could list like 20 more Pros..... but you get the idea. Thank you for all of your work Devs, I hope you can take a look at this thoroughly and not just take someone's word that it would not work. It could potentially work greatly, just like the IDOC changes were superb. Thank you again.

    -Polaris
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,027
    edited November 2020
    So instead of fix issues with the game.  Punish players and future players.  Not the game I want to play.

    Do a sting operation on the websites and ban the account about to sell you 20Plats.
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    edited November 2020
    Pawain said:
    So instead of fix issues with the game.  Punish players and future players.  Not the game I want to play.

    Do a sting operation on the websites and ban the account about to sell you 20Plats.
    If you look at my list of Pros that I posted, I think you will see that this is in no way punishing anyone. If they want a Slither, all one has to do is go to Luna and ask... someone will easily take you to one. What I posted fixes a great deal of cheating however, and encourages team work and authentic Ultima Online play by leaps and bounds. Is a new player going to return and search with the filter on VS for 5 HPI, 2 MR, 20 LRC, 15 Dmg Eater, 8 LMC, Fire Reist 21, Poison Resist 9? No... they are likely going to go to a vendor on someone's porch and see a nice armor piece and say, "Wow, this looks good" and buy it for 6,000 gp and go back and kill more Earth Eles and eventually some Liches / Daemons.

    I suggested the sting operation thing a few years ago. I am sure they have. But most of those sellers are likely smart enough to take the money first and give the gold on an EJ account. Sting failed.... that easily. Now if they could track gold transfers, that would be another story. But then you would have EJ bots trading varying amounts of gold 20,000 times a day so that it would literally become untrackable. There are methods to avoid detection in everything. With computers and repetitious bots it quickly becomes more difficult to catch than to not be caught. That is what I am guessing has always been happening. You can catch a person. You cannot catch the computer. The computer is not autonomous, but can repeat anything you or I can do a million times over before I can even write this reply to you. That's the sad reality.
  • AragornAragorn Posts: 234
    instead of completely blocking EJ account from vendor search maybe put a hard limit about the value that they can search from, say 5mil or as little as 1mil for example? Supposedly they can't afford it anyway if he's a genuine new player or if they are so good they should covert it into a normal account as EJ account shouldn't satisfy them anymore. 

    Or are you saying those bots are making money by buying mis-priced items? 
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,160
    edited November 2020
    Polaris said:
    This is the type of thinking that enables scripting. You have been around for decades Popps, I think you would understand that better than anyone, no? 

    Scripters use VPNs and a few of them have 10 different computers set up with different settings. (When you access websites and everything, it leaves a fingerprint of your PC details, software, windows, IP, and much more.) They can identify people by those PC settings. But by using VPNs in conjunction with certain software, they can replicate any type of "appearance" they want. If they wanted it to say they were using Windows 95, North Pole, and IP address 1000000001 it would. That it why it is virtually impossible to ban those guys.

    They are getting banned however. The huge 1000p+ castle that fell by fel Cove on Drachenfels 6 months ago is proof. Endless journey however, gives them an endless supply of replicatable bots that they can use. They do not even create bots.... they can use programs to recreate bots with different names every few days. They can use programs to sign up to email and Broadsword every few days with a brand new email and create brand new EJ accounts, every few days. EJ does not have to be tied to any other account, only an email which a bot can create in 20 seconds. Why do you think every site has those pictures like "Check all Crosswalks" or "Check Every Picture with Cars." The programs can do all of that outside of UO. Ultima Online, nor any game, has any way to detect outside programs aside from seeing a repetative string, such as when a bot gets stuck. As far as I know, the only thing they have to really do is transfer gold between accounts.

    Leaving EJ with gen chat privileges and VS harms the actual player base. Every item that people collect is getting swiped up by bots within hours after being placed on VS. Anything that meets their "threshold to buy" is getting bought and repriced. They should not be able to use 32 chars and vendor search every shard with replicatable accounts / bots over and over.

    The only way I can think of to fix this would be to stop EJ from using vendor search. Stopping them from gen chat would fix the gold sellers.... but I do not care so much about that spamming as I do about the vendor searching.

    Devs listened to me about the IDOC changes, and absolutely everyone is eternally grateful. The change was miraculous. Whoever came up with the barrel idea on top of what I was floating around was a genius. Please try to find a way to stop the abuse of EJ accounts though. Making an EJ only chat (that normal vet players could join too) is not a bad idea. That would funnel all the EJ players in together and they could easily make guilds and join up. They would not have to hear the toxic 12 year old chat going on on Atlantic gen chat.... which causes a ton of people to quit the game actually, trust me. Give them an EJ only chat and start every EJ char in Luna so that they automatically know where the people and vendors are. Most returning players never even find out what Luna is. A ton of guilds who want to recruit will go to the EJ chat and recruit people, trust me. It would likely be a hundred times better than general chat itself. There is no real need for EJ chars to vendor search. They are fighting mongbats and earth eles. They don't have nor should need an item that costs 5m.... little lone 175m or 5.5p. Stopping them from using gen. chat and VS would greatly help out the real players that have been playing for 10 or 15 years and want to play and are planning on staying.

    Apparant Cons:  Gold sellers will just go to the EJ forum to sell gold. This is a major win still.... they will lose a ton of their funding. The people trashing Mesanna would lose their funding. The Devs could even put out their own spam message on the EJ chat every 15 minutes that says "Buying Gold from those Websites is Illegal and You Will Be Banned. You also risk compromising your data and putting your PC at risk."

    Pros: 1) No more gold sellers on general chat. No more "anonymous" people on general chat bashing Devs, players, and Mesanna. Everyone on general chat should be tied to a paying account so that they are ban-able. 2) Actual new returning players will start in Luna. They will see people actually instead of someone selling gold on a chat. 3) EJ players won't be overwhelmed by prices so quickly. It will give them a more authentic Ultima Online feel and nostalgia. 4) There will be a new EJ chat channel. This will encourage groups, guilds, friends, and veteran players helping them out. 5) This will block scripts from searching vendor search. Vendor search will be a lot more efficient I bet! Meaning it will work better. 6) Veteran players will be able to collect the items they are after for once, instead of people buying / repricing items. 7) EJ accounts will be able to find vendors selling "lower tiered armor" that someone else is not buying up.

    I could list like 20 more Pros..... but you get the idea. Thank you for all of your work Devs, I hope you can take a look at this thoroughly and not just take someone's word that it would not work. It could potentially work greatly, just like the IDOC changes were superb. Thank you again.

    -Polaris
    I am thinking of a different solution, other then always playing the "cat and mouse" game to have to track them down while they use VPN and what not....

    What type of a solution ?

    Coding the Ultima Online Client so that, if it detects any non authorized software running together with the UO Client, the UO Client would simply "shut down".... just like we get that ahead warning before server down for maintainance....

    Only, that it would happen at any time throughout the day as soon as the UO Client detects non-authorized Third Party software running alongside with it....

    Want to play UO ? Sorry, you cannot use non-authorized software with it... put it in the TOS, and those players who still will fire up Third Party software to script in UO will simply end up with a game that is unplayable, since it will shut down as soon as the UO Client will detect un-authorized software up and running with the UO Client.

    It would not be necessary to track down the players and ban their accounts, they would simply be unable to do whatever they want to do using non-authorized scripting Third Party applications because the Ultima Online Client would self shut down and, thus, make that scripting simply impossible....

    This is only 1 possible idea about many that perhaps could be possible without having to play the cat and mouse game, endlessly...

    Also, I need to say something about Gold selling.....

    Why there is players capable of selling Gold in Ultima Online ?

    The easy answer is, because there is other players buying that gold....

    If there were no buyers, there would be no market and, thus, no sellers.....

    So, let's question ourselves.... on WHY there is players willing to buy gold (and items) in Ultima Online...

    The answer is, to my opinion, TIME.

    Since it takes time to stock up that gold or earn in game those items, some players figured that they are better off using their real life money which took them LESS time to earn, and spend it to buy UO gold or items....

    For example, how much does 1 Platinum of UO gold goes for ? Let's assume it is 150 US$.... now, even at 7.25 US$ per hour at minimum wage, that is about 20 hours of work... and there is lots of people that can earn better then minimum wage... so, let's assume that, for the average UO player, about 10 hours are sufficient to put together 150 bucks....

    How many hours, in the game, would be necessary to stock up 1 Platinum UO gold ?

    I would think a lot more hours that 10, 20 or even more....

    So, the reason why there is a market for Gold or UO items for real money is, to my opinion, due to the fact that it takes too much time in game to get that much gold or items and, therefore, several players think it a TIME SAVER for them to use their real life money to buy UO gold or items.

    To kill such a market for good, that is, make it pointless, all it would take is to make gold and items take much less time to be obtained in the game... at that point, why would players want to spend their real time money to buy them ? They would just spend a little time in the game and get them by themselves, saving up their real time money....

    So, it is my opinion, Ultima Online is victim of its own fault, is how I see it, by making gold and items not easy enough to be obtained, it basically is making it possible for this Real Money Trades market to go on since it makes it convenient for some players to want to use their real money to be spent on UO items and gold as this saves them time.....

    Make gold and items easier to be obtained in UO thus reducing the time it takes to get them in UO, and the RMT Market will melt like snow on a sunny day for luck of purchasing players, me thinks.
  • SethSeth Posts: 1,237
    Short comment

    I think its not that the Dev team not wanting to do anything about scripting,

    1) Is it even possible for a system that is 20 over years old?

    2) If yes, how much effort and cost is required? Need to rewrite entire code?

    3) If any of u are software engineers and have a cost effective solution, contact Mesanna or Bleak?



    We love bugs....
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    popps said:
    I am thinking of a different solution, other then always playing the "cat and mouse" game to have to track them down while they use VPN and what not....

    What type of a solution ?

    "Coding" -Paraphrased.
    I just got home from work and it is Thanksgiving.... there was an 18x18 IDOC just now and no less than 50 bots were there. 35-50 barrels were gone in less than 20 seconds.... I was able to punch 4 barrels, and I got 100k worth of loot. Wife and I logged out and got into an argument over UO. They are multi boxing barrel punching. Either that or running a script. In either scenario..... how do you suppose that they "code" the game so that it does not detect their mouse and keyboard strokes? That is simply all their scripts are... their mouse and keyboard strokes are just happening on 20-32 different accounts... depending if it's an IDOC or VS issue.

    Answer: It's impossible.

    There are only a few ways to help. I suggested 2. Here is another that I hope the Devs take a serious look at.
    1) Stop IDOCs completely. Let players loot go into a storage vault in a bank. They get it when they come back. No gold sellers, no scripters, no IDOCers like me complaining. No body losing sleep over a bunch of gold sellers destroying Ultima Online. This would be the single best thing ever and would take very little coding and have all of the desired effects.
    2) When a house falls, auction the plot. Devs did this with Clop's house. Don't let script placers sit here and sell castles all day long. If anyone has been able to "sell" a castle the past year.... they should automatically be banned, because you Know how they got it.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,027
    edited November 2020
    Polaris said:
    popps said:
    I am thinking of a different solution, other then always playing the "cat and mouse" game to have to track them down while they use VPN and what not....

    What type of a solution ?

    "Coding" -Paraphrased.
    I just got home from work and it is Thanksgiving.... there was an 18x18 IDOC just now and no less than 50 bots were there. 35-50 barrels were gone in less than 20 seconds.... I was able to punch 4 barrels, and I got 100k worth of loot. Wife and I logged out and got into an argument over UO. They are multi boxing barrel punching. Either that or running a script. In either scenario..... how do you suppose that they "code" the game so that it does not detect their mouse and keyboard strokes? That is simply all their scripts are... their mouse and keyboard strokes are just happening on 20-32 different accounts... depending if it's an IDOC or VS issue.

    Answer: It's impossible.

    There are only a few ways to help. I suggested 2. Here is another that I hope the Devs take a serious look at.
    1) Stop IDOCs completely. Let players loot go into a storage vault in a bank. They get it when they come back. No gold sellers, no scripters, no IDOCers like me complaining. No body losing sleep over a bunch of gold sellers destroying Ultima Online. This would be the single best thing ever and would take very little coding and have all of the desired effects.
    2) When a house falls, auction the plot. Devs did this with Clop's house. Don't let script placers sit here and sell castles all day long. If anyone has been able to "sell" a castle the past year.... they should automatically be banned, because you Know how they got it.
    Can EJ accounts get things from IDOCs?  If not. Then those are paying accounts. If this is Atlantic, there are many players at IDOCs. How do you know which are bots? How do you know these are not 50 controlled accounts?  Again you want to solve a problem you perceive by punishing players.  The games you make would not be fun to play.  That's why you do something else.
  • RockStaRRockStaR Posts: 164
    Ultima online has tried anticheat before. They tried it with punkbuster. Tibia... Another game that's literally just as old as Ultima online.... Has worked an anticheat program, called BattlEye... And... It has effectively gotten rid of 99.9% of all of the bots. 
  • RockStaRRockStaR Posts: 164
    https://www.mmorpg.com/ultima-online/news/punkbuster-2000060457

    Back in 2006 was when they tried punkbuster... They need to try something like BattlEye.
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    edited November 2020
    Pawain said:
    Can EJ accounts get things from IDOCs?  If not. Then those are paying accounts. If this is Atlantic, there are many players at IDOCs. How do you know which are bots? How do you know these are not 50 controlled accounts?  Again you want to solve a problem you perceive by punishing players.  The games you make would not be fun to play.  That's why you do something else.
    I never said those were EJ bots. Those are paying bots.....  I have saw about 4 of your recent posts and it seems you have flip flopped your stance on scripters. Someone else asked you the same on the other forum. I thought you used to be on our side Pawain? Unleashed must have opened up a whole new world to you.

    And if it's the case that it is just their play style and punishing other players.... what about the players that lost all of their items because of Covid or something.... a lost job? Why do we have to worry so much about punishing IDOCers? Why can we not worry about players who lost items because their houses fell returning? If it is the case that we should just let them keep multi-boxing barrel punching characters.... then the Devs just need to come out and tell the rest of us that we can do it too. The day they say that.... I promise I could do it better than them. They can not even play the game.... it is sad. As one person on the "unleashed forums" put it... a very famous girl who posts on here.... she 'only uses the fishing script because her fingers have carpel tunnel.' I play guitar and my fingers have carpel tunnel too.... but I don't get nor want that luxury. If that is how people have to play to enjoy their "playstyle" and I should just go and do something else as you suggest..... then why not open up that playstyle to me? Why do I have to be punished because I follow the rules of the game?

    It's funny.... no less than 1 minute after I entered the Unleashed forum on the "other site" and saw that they were literally ALL cheating and sharing scripts.... was the last day I went to that site. I told them all off and got put on Stinky P's (not right name of course) "Something" of the day post. Not the right name.... of course.
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    RockStaR said:
    Ultima online has tried anticheat before. They tried it with punkbuster. Tibia... Another game that's literally just as old as Ultima online.... Has worked an anticheat program, called BattlEye... And... It has effectively gotten rid of 99.9% of all of the bots. 
    This would be super. Does it stop mutli-boxing though? That seems to be the problem at IDOCs lately. One character controls 10 and they all punch the closest barrels with Pinko's or whatever it is that EC has that the CC does not.
  • RockStaRRockStaR Posts: 164
    Polaris said:
    RockStaR said:
    Ultima online has tried anticheat before. They tried it with punkbuster. Tibia... Another game that's literally just as old as Ultima online.... Has worked an anticheat program, called BattlEye... And... It has effectively gotten rid of 99.9% of all of the bots. 
    This would be super. Does it stop mutli-boxing though? That seems to be the problem at IDOCs lately. One character controls 10 and they all punch the closest barrels with Pinko's or whatever it is that EC has that the CC does not.
    @Polaris yes BattlEye can make it so only one client can be open at a time. But also, they have said we can have multiple clients open also. As long as you can control them, you can alt tab to pop the next screen up and punch a barrel. You just can't be unattended doing it. Or have it all linked to one key. To be fully legal, you gotta do it all manually.
  • poppspopps Posts: 2,160
    RockStaR said:
    Polaris said:
    RockStaR said:
    Ultima online has tried anticheat before. They tried it with punkbuster. Tibia... Another game that's literally just as old as Ultima online.... Has worked an anticheat program, called BattlEye... And... It has effectively gotten rid of 99.9% of all of the bots. 
    This would be super. Does it stop mutli-boxing though? That seems to be the problem at IDOCs lately. One character controls 10 and they all punch the closest barrels with Pinko's or whatever it is that EC has that the CC does not.
    @ Polaris yes BattlEye can make it so only one client can be open at a time. But also, they have said we can have multiple clients open also. As long as you can control them, you can alt tab to pop the next screen up and punch a barrel. You just can't be unattended doing it. Or have it all linked to one key. To be fully legal, you gotta do it all manually.
    That would be wonderfull.... If this BattleEye can stop multiboxing but allow manually played multi-client to be possible, would also take care of all those PvP cheaters (and PvM multi-boxers) who use multiple characters sharing the same macro keys so as to syncronize all of their characters to attack at once the same one target pressing the key "once" for it to work for all templates multi-boxed....

    @Kyronix and @Bleak , perhaps it might be worth for you to look into this BattleEye to implement  it into Ultima Online ?
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,027
    edited November 2020
    Polaris said:
    Pawain said:
    Can EJ accounts get things from IDOCs?  If not. Then those are paying accounts. If this is Atlantic, there are many players at IDOCs. How do you know which are bots? How do you know these are not 50 controlled accounts?  Again you want to solve a problem you perceive by punishing players.  The games you make would not be fun to play.  That's why you do something else.
    I never said those were EJ bots. Those are paying bots.....  I have saw about 4 of your recent posts and it seems you have flip flopped your stance on scripters. Someone else asked you the same on the other forum. I thought you used to be on our side Pawain? Unleashed must have opened up a whole new world to you.

    And if it's the case that it is just their play style and punishing other players.... what about the players that lost all of their items because of Covid or something.... a lost job? Why do we have to worry so much about punishing IDOCers? Why can we not worry about players who lost items because their houses fell returning? If it is the case that we should just let them keep multi-boxing barrel punching characters.... then the Devs just need to come out and tell the rest of us that we can do it too. The day they say that.... I promise I could do it better than them. They can not even play the game.... it is sad. As one person on the "unleashed forums" put it... a very famous girl who posts on here.... she 'only uses the fishing script because her fingers have carpel tunnel.' I play guitar and my fingers have carpel tunnel too.... but I don't get nor want that luxury. If that is how people have to play to enjoy their "playstyle" and I should just go and do something else as you suggest..... then why not open up that playstyle to me? Why do I have to be punished because I follow the rules of the game?

    It's funny.... no less than 1 minute after I entered the Unleashed forum on the "other site" and saw that they were literally ALL cheating and sharing scripts.... was the last day I went to that site. I told them all off and got put on Stinky P's (not right name of course) "Something" of the day post. Not the right name.... of course.
    I use CC with nothing else but a toothpick when needed. I have had lots of fun since Oct. 97 playing like that.  So get over yourself.

    Like I said, I would rather the devs fix their scripting problems in ways that do not affect my game play.  Also I have seen many returning players on LS using EJ. Many have upgraded accounts and are playing regularly.  Lake Superior has a totally different group of regular players than it did before EJ came out.

    Put your account on a credit card that has a few years on it if you don't want to lose things. Auto renew works just fine.



  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    edited November 2020
    Pawain said:
    I use CC with nothing else but a toothpick when needed. I have had lots of fun since Oct. 97 playing like that.  So get over yourself.

    Like I said, I would rather the devs fix their scripting problems in ways that do not affect my game play.  Also I have seen many returning players on LS using EJ. Many have upgraded accounts and are playing regularly.  Lake Superior has a totally different group of regular players than it did before EJ came out.

    Put your account on a credit card that has a few years on it if you don't want to lose things. Auto renew works just fine.

    What are you talking about? We have 9 accounts that we pay for..... I even pay for one for my nephew. My wife and I met on this game. Do you think I am EJ? I am trying to get them to stop EJ from using VS and General Chat. How is stopping that affecting your gameplay?

    If you want to leave EJ doing VS..... then the Devs have a problem w/ about 4 players using 32 EJ bots to Script vendor search. They then bring bots on general chat to trash Ultima, trash Mesanna, and make fun of players like me for actually going to work while they are making tons of money in Ultima. Someone said that 3 days ago.... I can go back to work and keep slaving for the capitalist slimes.... paraphrasing what they said..... while they will keep making twice as money money as me from Ultima. Their words..... on gen chat, from one of the guys who is there 24/7 making money.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,027
    It affects my game play because I like doing things in groups with those players. If they were not on chat, I would not know they exist. 

    It sounds like you think everyone is scripting.  Birds of a feather flock together.

    Want to know how many scriptors affect my play daily?  Zero.
  • SethSeth Posts: 1,237
    Pawain said:
    It affects my game play because I like doing things in groups with those players. If they were not on chat, I would not know they exist. 

    It sounds like you think everyone is scripting.  Birds of a feather flock together.

    Want to know how many scriptors affect my play daily?  Zero.
    Likewise, only heard alot here but seldom see any in action that affects my game. Maybe it exists only on some shards.
    We love bugs....
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    edited November 2020
    Pawain said:
    It affects my game play because I like doing things in groups with those players. If they were not on chat, I would not know they exist. 

    It sounds like you think everyone is scripting.  Birds of a feather flock together.

    Want to know how many scriptors affect my play daily?  Zero.
    It exists anywhere there is a potential to make gold to sell. I do not play the game for friends... I play the game to be number 1. That is what I play any game for.... from Super Mario Bros, to Street Fighter, to Mario Kart, to Halo, to Call of Duty. Most people play to win... we all are not simply looking to make friends with anonymous online players. I have enough of those in real life. I play Ultima to escape real life and be the king of my castle.... which I have never owned because scripters script place all of those.

    I am sorry if you just want to sit and chat and nothing affects Your game play. But it does affect people's like mine. I want to be able to get some server births, event items, collectibles, and hopefully one day a castle too.

    Birds of a feather.... Keith on the other site said that you were now taking the scripter's side as well. I have never scripted in my life and have been the number one voice speaking out against it.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,027
    edited November 2020
    You and Keith make a nice couple of conspiracy theorists.

    You never said how you know those players at the IDOC are bots.  Just because you say they are is not proof of anything.  You seriously think that 50 players wont be at an Atlantic IDOC?  People go to other shards and announce Atl IDOCs in chat. 
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    Pawain said:
    You and Keith make a nice couple of conspiracy theorists.

    You never said how you know those players at the IDOC are bots.  Just because you say they are is not proof of anything.  You seriously think that 50 players wont be at an Atlantic IDOC?  People go to other shards and announce Atl IDOCs in chat. 
    There was about 130 characters at that IDOC. I was just estimating that 50 were bots based on how many of them "running together" in 2-3 groups and punching the same barrels together. They likely knew everyone from the Dev team was gone for Thanksgiving and just went overboard with it. Someone had said there was phoenix armor there before it fell.... so they pulled out all the cards. There was no phoenix armor, but that is besides the point. It isn't usually that bad.... but that just goes to show what they are doing. I know what they are doing. Everyone does.... we can read the forums and ICQ chats.
  • PawainPawain Posts: 4,027
    edited November 2020
    Polaris said:
    Pawain said:
    You and Keith make a nice couple of conspiracy theorists.

    You never said how you know those players at the IDOC are bots.  Just because you say they are is not proof of anything.  You seriously think that 50 players wont be at an Atlantic IDOC?  People go to other shards and announce Atl IDOCs in chat. 
    There was about 130 characters at that IDOC. I was just estimating that 50 were bots based on how many of them "running together" in 2-3 groups and punching the same barrels together. They likely knew everyone from the Dev team was gone for Thanksgiving and just went overboard with it. Someone had said there was phoenix armor there before it fell.... so they pulled out all the cards. There was no phoenix armor, but that is besides the point. It isn't usually that bad.... but that just goes to show what they are doing. I know what they are doing. Everyone does.... we can read the forums and ICQ chats.
    So not only do you know they were bots but you also know what they did not get.  ICQ chat is probably as reliable as facebook.  You probably believe those conspiracy theories also. Q
  • PolarisPolaris Posts: 101
    edited November 2020
    Pawain said:
    So not only do you know they were bots but you also know what they did not get.  ICQ chat is probably as reliable as facebook.  You probably believe those conspiracy theories also. Q
    There are two IDOC groups in the game. I am sure I cannot say their names on these forums, but the Devs are well aware of who they are. One of the IDOC group leaders had a website with his name in the address, that listed all of the IDOCS on every shard, had maps to each one, with the exact locations wrote down and the exact time the signs used to change. Many prominent people were invited to his ICQ group 3-4 years ago. That includes 2-3 of the Stratics moderators. One of them admitted it and said there was indeed a group 2-3 years ago on Stratics when I was trying so hard to get them to change IDOCs. That was when the whole thing got blown wide open; they should not have invited non cheaters to join their message groups. Us that knew the details from friends were the ones who tried so hard 2-4 years ago and got IDOCs changed to private and then to barrels. Thank God the Devs took action.

    The two groups were at war with each other and hated each other. You will notice now... there are two different sets of character names spamming two different websites in general chat. I know exactly what I am talking about. You have no idea... go back to Stratics Unleashed, which you are a member of, and read some more of the posts with the scripts they share. Like Keith of Sonoma said, it looks like you are taking their side now. Funny how the times change, you were on our side before Unleashed came out on Stratics. I wonder what changed your mind? Read Atlantic chat a little bit when the spammers and myself get into arguments. They laughed two days ago and told me to go back to work at lunchtime, they make 4x as much as me from Ultima they said. If I could say their names and make it a little less conspiratorial for you I would. But that I will not. I just hope the Devs get their bots off of General Chat and Vendor Search. You would think it would be a major issue with them on the chat trashing the Devs and Mesanna all day. They should have been banned the first time someone did that.
  • MariahMariah Posts: 1,567Moderator
    This thread is going no where. Please send the info you can not post here to uo@broadsword.com  Use the ingame help system to report trashing of Broadsword staff in chat. This forum is not the right medium, given the forum's ToS.
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