Pet only powerscrolls

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Comments

  • TimStTimSt Posts: 1,466
    Cookie said:
    TimSt said:
    I wrote it correctly: No PvP in the entire shard.  Since I run away when ever any one tries to PvP me if I jump to a No PvP shard the PvPers would not miss me.

    I know what you meant Tim, but your sentence lead to the opposite interpretation.

    "The Fel facet still has champ spawns that drop 120 scrolls but there is no PvP to worry about."

    So for the record, yes, I would be ok with your intended concept. A complete Trammel facet or facets that cannot interact with Felucca, and complete Felucca facets with the entire gaming map, under the current gameplay rules.

    Just to be clear there would still be a Fel facet but it would not have PvP.  The Fel facet would still have 120 level scrolls.  You would not be able to transfer to or from the other production shards like Atlantic. Sort of like Siege but with no PvP.
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,026
    Cookie said:

    Popps, we have seen that so many times, it's so factually incorrect it's really boring, please stop rolling it out all the time. There were so many other external factors at that exact point in time. UO was growing massively, just because of it's prior reputation, the fact Trammel came in at the same time, was coincidence. This is the problem with Theory-crafters like yourself, you were never there to see it, witness it, feel it, understand it.

    What is really really obvious to everyone, is if you create Easymode and Hardmode, and give Easymode absolutely everything, the whole playerbase is going to go to Easymode - it had nothing to do with PvP! All PvPers are, are enhanced AI - that is the only way you need to see them, you can dehumanise them. Easymode is what ruined the game completely, and everyones failure to see this. It's very much like saying to a working age population - you can work for your money, or just be given it all via benefits - absolutely no penalty. 80% of people, would chose to receive the benefits and not work. But it would destroy the society in terms of progression, and mental attitude. They would be so weak minded. The comparison is so obvious, you lot astound me with your blindness and ignorance.

    Now if they had separated Easymode, and Hardmode, this may have been ok, to be fair to them, they could not have envisioned this 20 years ago how this would go. But they maintained a link between the modes, and allowed everyone to farm the hell out of Easymode, and use it all to destroy the quality of Hardmode.

    They needed to have the guts to stick with their original vision.

    Trammel a coincidence ?

    LOL 

    Trammel saved Ultima Online !!

    PKilling was driving away from UO so many players that, had it not been for the creation of Trammel, UO would have been dead long ago....

    And infact, Trammel, as it is pointed out in the Link I gave in the other Post, DOUBLED UO player's base which was plummetting because of Player Killing....

    Check also out this other interview to Raph Koster at https://www.raphkoster.com/games/interviews-and-panels/live-forum-qa-with-raph-koster-1016/

    Where he says many interesting things among which these passages caught my attention, particularly...

    I do think a modern UO would not succeed with freeform PvP. It might well have PvP in it, but the whole gankfest thing is definitely a thing of the past. I never got to try the Outcasting concept that was proposed for SWG and never implemented, and would still love to see it tried (if you PK someone, they can report you to fellow players, along with a log of the event. If you are convicted, your right to PvP is permanently revoked). But even that, in these days of easy account creation on F2P games, maybe wouldn’t work. Bad guys would just make new accounts.

    To me the essence of sandboxiness that was in UO and SWG is not about the PKing. It is about a simulated world, a functioning economy, a low power difference between high and low level players, and a system that doesn’t push you into combat as the only way to play the game (or even classes).
    and

    I do believe in a crime/punishment system. But everything we tried did fall prey to new accounts and killers who just didn’t care. If they have no emotional attachment to losing (e.g., don’t give a shit) then there isn’t any in-game punishment you can offer up. I don’t know if you were around for it, but I tried for a LONG time to get that balance right in SWG. Bounty systems became high score tables. Rewards were claimed by dummy accounts. Most everything we tried became a tool for the bad guys. And the good guys literally had no way to win, because the bad guys could just come back the next day, over and over, and just wear your spirit down.
    Like it or not, player killing was killing Ultima Online losing many players having enough of it.... Trammel, was what saved Ultima Online and, infact, it is a FACT that as soon as Trammel was created Ultima Online's population doubled.....

    That is no coincidence, as I understand it, had it not been for Trammel, players' numbers in Ultima Online would have been driven down by pkilling so much that it would have been shut down for good long ago, to my opinion.
  • RorschachRorschach Posts: 377Moderator
    edited June 2020
    If the users of this forum wish to turn this into a debate of the merits of Felucca vs Trammel, I will insist that the Terms of Service be adhered to strictly and all posts that are less that courteous or respectful will be removed.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    TimSt said:
    Just to be clear there would still be a Fel facet but it would not have PvP.  The Fel facet would still have 120 level scrolls.  You would not be able to transfer to or from the other production shards like Atlantic. Sort of like Siege but with no PvP.

    Err Tim, you have completely lost me then, I really did not understand you.

    This makes no sense on any level I'm sorry.

  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    popps said:
    Trammel a coincidence ?

    LOL 

    Trammel saved Ultima Online !!

    PKilling was driving away from UO so many players that, had it not been for the creation of Trammel, UO would have been dead long ago....

    And infact, Trammel, as it is pointed out in the Link I gave in the other Post, DOUBLED UO player's base which was plummetting because of Player Killing....

    Check also out this other interview to Raph Koster at https://www.raphkoster.com/games/interviews-and-panels/live-forum-qa-with-raph-koster-1016/

    Where he says many interesting things among which these passages caught my attention, particularly...

    I do think a modern UO would not succeed with freeform PvP. It might well have PvP in it, but the whole gankfest thing is definitely a thing of the past. I never got to try the Outcasting concept that was proposed for SWG and never implemented, and would still love to see it tried (if you PK someone, they can report you to fellow players, along with a log of the event. If you are convicted, your right to PvP is permanently revoked). But even that, in these days of easy account creation on F2P games, maybe wouldn’t work. Bad guys would just make new accounts.

    To me the essence of sandboxiness that was in UO and SWG is not about the PKing. It is about a simulated world, a functioning economy, a low power difference between high and low level players, and a system that doesn’t push you into combat as the only way to play the game (or even classes).
    and

    I do believe in a crime/punishment system. But everything we tried did fall prey to new accounts and killers who just didn’t care. If they have no emotional attachment to losing (e.g., don’t give a shit) then there isn’t any in-game punishment you can offer up. I don’t know if you were around for it, but I tried for a LONG time to get that balance right in SWG. Bounty systems became high score tables. Rewards were claimed by dummy accounts. Most everything we tried became a tool for the bad guys. And the good guys literally had no way to win, because the bad guys could just come back the next day, over and over, and just wear your spirit down.
    Like it or not, player killing was killing Ultima Online losing many players having enough of it.... Trammel, was what saved Ultima Online and, infact, it is a FACT that as soon as Trammel was created Ultima Online's population doubled.....

    That is no coincidence, as I understand it, had it not been for Trammel, players' numbers in Ultima Online would have been driven down by pkilling so much that it would have been shut down for good long ago, to my opinion.


    This is a huge topic, and I won't be able to answer it fully, I have done it before, but it seems you didn't get it when I did. I'm not going to do it again, and explain all the external factors.

    Trammel was a coincidence, Yes.

    1. Throughout the world, most people were using 56k modems when UO came out, UO was technologically ahead of its time with the concept of an MMORPG, the systems could not cope, there was massive Lag everywhere, this is what was ruining the gaming experience for people, read any of the reviews at the time. You could not move, you crashed out all the time.

    2. On a 56k modem, it was costing me £250 per month to play UO in the early days! I was playing it nonstop over a telephone line from a school IT room with 20 pc's that my father in law owned.

    3. Only some countries, such as Sweden and Scandinavia had fibre or cable as standard in those days, and they were renowned as the best PvPers, because, it was all about connection in those days.

    4. Then! Cable and Fibre were introduced on a more worldwide scale, people started getting them everywhere, this actually made UO playable, and the monthly connection charges went down to more reasonable prices - so UO became playable, AND cheap enough for the masses to play.

    5. Trammel came out at the exact moment of this explosion of interest in UO.

    6. Now the problem with Trammel was this - UO then forced all new players into Trammel, they did not have a choice where they started! It was Trammel, so a lot of new players by now, never even realised Felucca existed, they only got to see Easymode.

    7. And from then on, Trammel got all the new players, AND got all of the Content. AND it was Easymode. This is still the case today - It's a miracle Felucca even exists. With this mix of factors, it is easy to see why Trammel became successful.

    The game was so driven towards Trammel, there was no other choice. Players had to make a definitive choice to go to Felucca, and most had obviously got used to the EasyLife by then.

    But what I can tell you, is the game was a far better concept in its original state, and this is the game players are nostalgic for, and remember fondly. Not the later Trammel version.



  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    edited June 2020

    "I do believe in a crime/punishment system. But everything we tried did fall prey to new accounts and killers who just didn’t care. If they have no emotional attachment to losing (e.g., don’t give a shit) then there isn’t any in-game punishment you can offer up. I don’t know if you were around for it, but I tried for a LONG time to get that balance right in SWG. Bounty systems became high score tables. Rewards were claimed by dummy accounts. Most everything we tried became a tool for the bad guys. And the good guys literally had no way to win, because the bad guys could just come back the next day, over and over, and just wear your spirit down."


    I'll take this quote, and disagree with the Developer. In the early days, they had the bounty system, which people remember well and was fun. They had the Stat and Skill-Loss system which worked. Even the Virtue, and Town Buff system could be used for these purposes, what the problem often was, was the systems had bugs that were able to be exploited making them redundant. I agree everything became a tool for the bad guys, but that is because the systems often had such simple flaws that could easily have been fixed, that put huge holes in them.

    In the old days, player towns were created, these dealt with the problem, players could find their own solutions. Anti-PK's existed. I've been an anti-PK my entire gaming life, or a Factioner, and I'm still here having no problems. These scenarios, created situations where players had to team up and work together, and that really was the point. You could go lone-wolf for sure, but that was a much harder playstyle.

    One problem often is regarding PvP and PvM is that the playstyles require different templates and gear. If you are doing a Champ spawn, you need to have PvM gear to be able to deal with the mobs, if you are PvPing, you are specifically designed to kill players and nothing else. There is also the element of surprise, the PvMers are working the spawn, and can be hit at any time, and 9 times out of 10, the element of surprise gets the PvMers if they are not well organised with defences the whole way through. PvMers can combat this, by again working in teams, and having PvPers specifically there to protect them - hence the Justice system, now abused by most PvMers as just a way to get more scrolls for themselves. The reason the Champ spawn guilds are so successful, is they are teaming and playing the game the way it was designed to be played. The reason the rest of you fail, is because you are not doing it properly.

    I did always feel though, because the PvMers faced the tougher challenge - Being on weaker templates, in weaker gear, working the mobs and being hit by surprise - that they actually deserved bonuses that should help them defend themselves - this to me was always the flaw, the futility of most of the PvMers fight. Now the Virtues, and Town Buffs etc, should be used as a way to give bonuses, to help them fight back or survive better. The problem on the part of most PvMers however, is they just tried to go out and solo it all, this was never the intention, and most PvMers whine because they cannot solo everything.

    To me, where the Developer gave up, he just needed to do better, make the systems tighter.

  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    Rorschach said:
    If the users of this forum wish to turn this into a debate of the merits of Felucca vs Trammel, I will insist that the Terms of Service be adhered to strictly and all posts that are less that courteous or respectful will be removed.


    Hi Rorschach, Understood, I'm trying! Like someone above mentioned, it's like talking to a brick wall sometimes, and it gets so frustrating! You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot force it to drink.

    The problem with the Powerscrolls issue, is it is intrinsically linked to Felucca v Trammel. It is almost the ONLY unique thing Felucca has - I really hope you understand what we are trying to say in terms of just how much Trammel has, and just how much the Trammel system destroys entire UO gaming content by the fact is able to be farmed non-stop completely risk free.

    If the Developers put Powerscrolls into Trammel, it's goodbye to the Powerscroll content system, in the same way Mastery Primers were wiped out in about 2 weeks by having them so freely available. Or gold which has become so inflated by non-stop scripting. Or Resources such as Imbuing reagents/Ingots/Wood have become so plentiful by non-stop safe scripting that gatherers have no role left in the game.

    Not only are we debating for the Powerscroll content  system so it doesn't become erased and become nothing, we are debating for one of the only Unique points left in Felucca that has any challenge left in the game.

  • jelinidasjelinidas Posts: 324
    One last time. Pets do not need to be scrolled out to 120 to kill stuff. A pet scrolled to 110 or 115 kills stuff just fine! On the shards I play, 105 and 110 scrolls can be had for free just by asking nicely. Perhaps even 115s! If you do not want to go to Fel, then don't! Your game is not over!

    Find some pet calculators, enter some numbers. Have fun and quit trying to change everything in game to fit just you!

    https://www.uo-cah.com/pet-damage-calculator
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,026
    Cookie said:
    Rorschach said:
    If the users of this forum wish to turn this into a debate of the merits of Felucca vs Trammel, I will insist that the Terms of Service be adhered to strictly and all posts that are less that courteous or respectful will be removed.


    Hi Rorschach, Understood, I'm trying! Like someone above mentioned, it's like talking to a brick wall sometimes, and it gets so frustrating! You can lead a horse to water, but you cannot force it to drink.

    The problem with the Powerscrolls issue, is it is intrinsically linked to Felucca v Trammel. It is almost the ONLY unique thing Felucca has - I really hope you understand what we are trying to say in terms of just how much Trammel has, and just how much the Trammel system destroys entire UO gaming content by the fact is able to be farmed non-stop completely risk free.

    If the Developers put Powerscrolls into Trammel, it's goodbye to the Powerscroll content system, in the same way Mastery Primers were wiped out in about 2 weeks by having them so freely available. Or gold which has become so inflated by non-stop scripting. Or Resources such as Imbuing reagents/Ingots/Wood have become so plentiful by non-stop safe scripting that gatherers have no role left in the game.

    Not only are we debating for the Powerscroll content  system so it doesn't become erased and become nothing, we are debating for one of the only Unique points left in Felucca that has any challenge left in the game.

    The problem with the Powerscrolls issue, is it is intrinsically linked to Felucca v Trammel. It is almost the ONLY unique thing Felucca has - I really hope you understand what we are trying to say in terms of just how much Trammel has, and just how much the Trammel system destroys entire UO gaming content by the fact is able to be farmed non-stop completely risk free.
    I do not think that is a problem for any red out there is it ?

    Don't they all have their Blues who can go to Trammel no problem and do their hunts in Trammel just as well they do their in Felucca ?

    So, I would say, it is the PvMers who here have the short end of the stick, not the PvPers who can easily do both, Felucca AND Trammel...

  • MerusMerus Posts: 511
    edited June 2020
    popps said:


    Don't they all have their Blues who can go to Trammel no problem and do their hunts in Trammel just as well they do their in Felucca ?

    So, I would say, it is the PvMers who here have the short end of the stick, not the PvPers who can easily do both, Felucca AND Trammel...

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  

    One of the most successful elements of a sandbox mmo is that it provides content for a multitude of play styles.  Miners and Fisherman can play UO and have fun.  Crafters can play UO and have fun.  Warriors and Mages can play UO and have fun.  Treasure hunters can play UO and have fun.  PvPers can play UO and have fun.  Each of those playstyles have, to some degree, unique rewards (though not every reward carries the same economic value as determined by the players willingness to purchase).  Many players in UO, like myself, participate in most of the content that is available through various character templates.  I have crafters.  I have fisherman.  I have tamers.  I have treasure hunters. I have mages.  I have warriors.  I have PvPers (sort of).  Even then there is some elements of those characters I do not do (BoDs for example).  When I want a reward I choose whether to get it myself or buy it based on what I am willing to do and what I enjoy doing.  Arguing for the removal of a reward for a certain playstyle because you, or even a majority of players, think the content to acquire the reward is difficult or requires a playstyle you don't enjoy is a bit absurd.  As has been stated multiple times in this thread, if you chose not to go to Fel, that is fine... its your choice.  There is more than ample content in UO that can be done in the Tram ruleset that can be bought and sold to purchase or trade for powerscrolls.

  • poppspopps Posts: 3,026
    edited June 2020
    Merus said:
    popps said:


    Don't they all have their Blues who can go to Trammel no problem and do their hunts in Trammel just as well they do their in Felucca ?

    So, I would say, it is the PvMers who here have the short end of the stick, not the PvPers who can easily do both, Felucca AND Trammel...

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  

    One of the most successful elements of a sandbox mmo is that it provides content for a multitude of play styles.  Miners and Fisherman can play UO and have fun.  Crafters can play UO and have fun.  Warriors and Mages can play UO and have fun.  Treasure hunters can play UO and have fun.  PvPers can play UO and have fun.  Each of those playstyles have, to some degree, unique rewards (though not every reward carries the same economic value as determined by the players willingness to purchase).  Many players in UO, like myself, participate in most of the content that is available through various character templates.  I have crafters.  I have fisherman.  I have tamers.  I have treasure hunters. I have mages.  I have warriors.  I have PvPers (sort of).  Even then there is some elements of those characters I do not do (BoDs for example).  When I want a reward I choose whether to get it myself or buy it based on what I am willing to do and what I enjoy doing.  Arguing for the removal of a reward for a certain playstyle because you, or even a majority of players, think the content to acquire the reward is difficult or requires a playstyle you don't enjoy is a bit absurd.  As has been stated multiple times in this thread, if you chose not to go to Fel, that is fine... its your choice.  There is more than ample content in UO that can be done in the Tram ruleset that can be bought and sold to purchase or trade for powerscrolls.

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  
    I am afraid it is not broken when, guess what, it is in PvP, not all, mind you, but some yes, that players tend to use hacks, cheats and Third Party progs to gain an unfair edge...

    There is players who do not want to deal with those cheats, hacks and whatnot and, so, since it "happens" that they are more often used in PvP as what they may be in PvM, quite a good number of player just decide to stay out of PvP not to have to deal with those hacks, cheats and whatnot hich they do not want to use.

    All these players, to my opinion, should not be penalized with content which they then cannot access because the game they are playing happens to not have succeeded in getting rid of cheats, hacks and what not.

    For many it is not a choice not to deal with Felucca and PvP, it is just that they do not want to have anything to do with cheats, hacks and whatnot which, unfortunately, "sometimes" are used in PvP to gain an edge because, that's unfortunate, that game was not succesfull in stopping their use.

    What is the point of engaging in PvP for someone who does not want to use cheats, hacks and whatnot, no matter what, when there is chances that the opponent would be using them instead ?

    Better not have anything to do with it, entirely, methinks.

    At least, that is the way I see it.

  • MerusMerus Posts: 511
    popps said:
    Merus said:
    popps said:


    Don't they all have their Blues who can go to Trammel no problem and do their hunts in Trammel just as well they do their in Felucca ?

    So, I would say, it is the PvMers who here have the short end of the stick, not the PvPers who can easily do both, Felucca AND Trammel...

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  

    One of the most successful elements of a sandbox mmo is that it provides content for a multitude of play styles.  Miners and Fisherman can play UO and have fun.  Crafters can play UO and have fun.  Warriors and Mages can play UO and have fun.  Treasure hunters can play UO and have fun.  PvPers can play UO and have fun.  Each of those playstyles have, to some degree, unique rewards (though not every reward carries the same economic value as determined by the players willingness to purchase).  Many players in UO, like myself, participate in most of the content that is available through various character templates.  I have crafters.  I have fisherman.  I have tamers.  I have treasure hunters. I have mages.  I have warriors.  I have PvPers (sort of).  Even then there is some elements of those characters I do not do (BoDs for example).  When I want a reward I choose whether to get it myself or buy it based on what I am willing to do and what I enjoy doing.  Arguing for the removal of a reward for a certain playstyle because you, or even a majority of players, think the content to acquire the reward is difficult or requires a playstyle you don't enjoy is a bit absurd.  As has been stated multiple times in this thread, if you chose not to go to Fel, that is fine... its your choice.  There is more than ample content in UO that can be done in the Tram ruleset that can be bought and sold to purchase or trade for powerscrolls.

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  
    I am afraid it is not broken when, guess what, it is in PvP, not all, mind you, but some yes, that players tend to use hacks, cheats and Third Party progs to gain an unfair edge...

    There is players who do not want to deal with those cheats, hacks and whatnot and, so, since it "happens" that they are more often used in PvP as what they may be in PvM, quite a good number of player just decide to stay out of PvP not to have to deal with those hacks, cheats and whatnot hich they do not want to use.

    All these players, to my opinion, should not be penalized with content which they then cannot access because the game they are playing happens to not have succeeded in getting rid of cheats, hacks and what not.

    For many it is not a choice not to deal with Felucca and PvP, it is just that they do not want to have anything to do with cheats, hacks and whatnot which, unfortunately, "sometimes" are used in PvP to gain an edge because, that's unfortunate, that game was not succesfull in stopping their use.

    What is the point of engaging in PvP for someone who does not want to use cheats, hacks and whatnot, no matter what, when there is chances that the opponent would be using them instead ?

    Better not have anything to do with it, entirely, methinks.

    At least, that is the way I see it.

    Cheats are far more prevalent in Tram content that Fel content, so your logic still fails.  Furthermore, there is plenty of opportunity to do Fel content without interacting with other players if you are smart about it... but there is always the risk of it happening.
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,026
    edited June 2020
    Merus said:
    popps said:
    Merus said:
    popps said:


    Don't they all have their Blues who can go to Trammel no problem and do their hunts in Trammel just as well they do their in Felucca ?

    So, I would say, it is the PvMers who here have the short end of the stick, not the PvPers who can easily do both, Felucca AND Trammel...

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  

    One of the most successful elements of a sandbox mmo is that it provides content for a multitude of play styles.  Miners and Fisherman can play UO and have fun.  Crafters can play UO and have fun.  Warriors and Mages can play UO and have fun.  Treasure hunters can play UO and have fun.  PvPers can play UO and have fun.  Each of those playstyles have, to some degree, unique rewards (though not every reward carries the same economic value as determined by the players willingness to purchase).  Many players in UO, like myself, participate in most of the content that is available through various character templates.  I have crafters.  I have fisherman.  I have tamers.  I have treasure hunters. I have mages.  I have warriors.  I have PvPers (sort of).  Even then there is some elements of those characters I do not do (BoDs for example).  When I want a reward I choose whether to get it myself or buy it based on what I am willing to do and what I enjoy doing.  Arguing for the removal of a reward for a certain playstyle because you, or even a majority of players, think the content to acquire the reward is difficult or requires a playstyle you don't enjoy is a bit absurd.  As has been stated multiple times in this thread, if you chose not to go to Fel, that is fine... its your choice.  There is more than ample content in UO that can be done in the Tram ruleset that can be bought and sold to purchase or trade for powerscrolls.

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  
    I am afraid it is not broken when, guess what, it is in PvP, not all, mind you, but some yes, that players tend to use hacks, cheats and Third Party progs to gain an unfair edge...

    There is players who do not want to deal with those cheats, hacks and whatnot and, so, since it "happens" that they are more often used in PvP as what they may be in PvM, quite a good number of player just decide to stay out of PvP not to have to deal with those hacks, cheats and whatnot hich they do not want to use.

    All these players, to my opinion, should not be penalized with content which they then cannot access because the game they are playing happens to not have succeeded in getting rid of cheats, hacks and what not.

    For many it is not a choice not to deal with Felucca and PvP, it is just that they do not want to have anything to do with cheats, hacks and whatnot which, unfortunately, "sometimes" are used in PvP to gain an edge because, that's unfortunate, that game was not succesfull in stopping their use.

    What is the point of engaging in PvP for someone who does not want to use cheats, hacks and whatnot, no matter what, when there is chances that the opponent would be using them instead ?

    Better not have anything to do with it, entirely, methinks.

    At least, that is the way I see it.

    Cheats are far more prevalent in Tram content that Fel content, so your logic still fails.  Furthermore, there is plenty of opportunity to do Fel content without interacting with other players if you are smart about it... but there is always the risk of it happening.
    Yeah right, with Ghost Cams or Hidden EJ Cams perhaps even used AFK and scripted....

    Sure....

    And while cheats used in PvM may only affect the player using them, those used in PvP affect, and pretty significantly (they can cost the loss of the fight....), the counterpart of that fight which, it goes without saying, in PvP is a another fellow player....

    There is a HUGE difference there, to my viewing.....
  • MerusMerus Posts: 511
    edited June 2020
    popps said:
    Merus said:
    popps said:
    Merus said:
    popps said:


    Don't they all have their Blues who can go to Trammel no problem and do their hunts in Trammel just as well they do their in Felucca ?

    So, I would say, it is the PvMers who here have the short end of the stick, not the PvPers who can easily do both, Felucca AND Trammel...

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  

    One of the most successful elements of a sandbox mmo is that it provides content for a multitude of play styles.  Miners and Fisherman can play UO and have fun.  Crafters can play UO and have fun.  Warriors and Mages can play UO and have fun.  Treasure hunters can play UO and have fun.  PvPers can play UO and have fun.  Each of those playstyles have, to some degree, unique rewards (though not every reward carries the same economic value as determined by the players willingness to purchase).  Many players in UO, like myself, participate in most of the content that is available through various character templates.  I have crafters.  I have fisherman.  I have tamers.  I have treasure hunters. I have mages.  I have warriors.  I have PvPers (sort of).  Even then there is some elements of those characters I do not do (BoDs for example).  When I want a reward I choose whether to get it myself or buy it based on what I am willing to do and what I enjoy doing.  Arguing for the removal of a reward for a certain playstyle because you, or even a majority of players, think the content to acquire the reward is difficult or requires a playstyle you don't enjoy is a bit absurd.  As has been stated multiple times in this thread, if you chose not to go to Fel, that is fine... its your choice.  There is more than ample content in UO that can be done in the Tram ruleset that can be bought and sold to purchase or trade for powerscrolls.

    Popps, your logic is so broken...

    ALL content is equally available to ALL players.  A player who makes a red character is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  A player who chooses not to go to Fel is making a choice to limit some of the content available to them.  You have just as much of an option to create a PvP template as PvPer's have to create PvM templates.  Your beef seems to be that PvPers are willing to do both to attain the rewards they are after, whereas you are unwilling to.  You want all the reward for the PvM templates.  
    I am afraid it is not broken when, guess what, it is in PvP, not all, mind you, but some yes, that players tend to use hacks, cheats and Third Party progs to gain an unfair edge...

    There is players who do not want to deal with those cheats, hacks and whatnot and, so, since it "happens" that they are more often used in PvP as what they may be in PvM, quite a good number of player just decide to stay out of PvP not to have to deal with those hacks, cheats and whatnot hich they do not want to use.

    All these players, to my opinion, should not be penalized with content which they then cannot access because the game they are playing happens to not have succeeded in getting rid of cheats, hacks and what not.

    For many it is not a choice not to deal with Felucca and PvP, it is just that they do not want to have anything to do with cheats, hacks and whatnot which, unfortunately, "sometimes" are used in PvP to gain an edge because, that's unfortunate, that game was not succesfull in stopping their use.

    What is the point of engaging in PvP for someone who does not want to use cheats, hacks and whatnot, no matter what, when there is chances that the opponent would be using them instead ?

    Better not have anything to do with it, entirely, methinks.

    At least, that is the way I see it.

    Cheats are far more prevalent in Tram content that Fel content, so your logic still fails.  Furthermore, there is plenty of opportunity to do Fel content without interacting with other players if you are smart about it... but there is always the risk of it happening.
    Yeah right, with Ghost Cams or Hidden EJ Cams perhaps even used AFK and scripted....

    Sure....

    And while cheats used in PvM may only affect the player using them, those used in PvP affect, and pretty significantly (they can cost the loss of the fight....), the counterpart of that fight which, it goes without saying, in PvP is a another fellow player....

    There is a HUGE difference there, to my viewing.....


    Again with broken logic... AFK or script farmed resources, gold and drops affect far, FAR more players through their economic impact than someone who uses a pvp cheat program to win a fight.
  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    edited June 2020
    popps said:
    Yeah right, with Ghost Cams or Hidden EJ Cams perhaps even used AFK and scripted....

    Sure....

    And while cheats used in PvM may only affect the player using them, those used in PvP affect, and pretty significantly (they can cost the loss of the fight....), the counterpart of that fight which, it goes without saying, in PvP is a another fellow player....

    There is a HUGE difference there, to my viewing.....


    No, you are missing the point completely here Popps.

    The cheats used in Trammel, in PvM, are the ones completely destroying the game, and ironically creating the scenario you are actually complaining about. Ridiculous prices due to rampant Gold Inflation - this isn't coming from Felucca as I explained right at the start of my posts, and you are still unable to see it yet. This is coming from free, no risk, 100% safe, completely unactionable 24/7 scripting in Trammel. In Felucca, when we see this, we just kill them, and stop the game becoming unbalanced for absolutely everyone. I don't think you appreciate how much Feluccan's care about the balance of the whole game for everyone, as we realise how it should be played, and how everything should be interlinked and balanced.

    The cheats used in PvP, allow 1 player or team to beat another player or team, they are annoying as hell, trust me I know, I'm the guy fighting them, not you, you wouldn't stand a chance due to lack of skill, preparation, experience and the fact you are all just theory-craft, and you don't have a calm enough mindset for it. You would not be able to beat them, with or without cheats. What you could do however, is join a team, and specialise in your role, to help the team succeed, that is the proactive thing you could do to make all your dreams come true, so you don't have to keep trying to change the entire game on the forums for everyone else.

    Honestly, if I thought you had any sort of point, or logic here, I would be backing you up, but I'm not. I have backed you up quite a few times when everyone else is losing it due to your complete inability to comprehend or empathise with anything outside of your own box.

  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    LMMFAO
    The only reason Fel exists is because of Power Scrolls and the only reason PvP still exists is because of Power Scrolls.  PvP is just the greatest thing in UO is all bullcrap and you know it.  Without the LURES PvP would have died.
    1997 UO was born Fel only

    2000 Tram was born because subs were falling because of the rampant lawlessness.  UO had very little time left because everybody was quitting or had removed there CC data so EA made UO do a quick fix and Tram was the fastest way.  Subs returned and the population grew.

    2002 Power Scrolls and Stat Scrolls  were introduced to Fel because Fel was a ghost town and the PvPers/PKers needed a way to LURE sheep to fel.  Spawns were controlled by Zerg Guilds.

    2003 UO was at its peak with an estimated 350K accounts and Age of Shit was born and UO has been in a downward spiral ever since.

    The only reason people even go to Fel is because of Power Scrolls and double resources not because of PvP.  PKers kill PvMers doing the spawn to steal the power scrolls and call that PvP, LMAO what a load of crap.  If PvP was so great then SP would be the #1 shard in UO.

    There may be some PvMers out there running LOOT programs but why when the EC can do it for you from what I understand but it is almost guaranteed that every PvPer is running illegal programs because that is the only way they can win.

    A person set up to kill another player that is set up to kill a boss is far from PvP but you keep telling people that this is real PvP.  Putting on GM made gear and fight someone with GM made gear was real PvP and what do we have now Gear and programs set up to kill PvMers clearing a spawn now that was so OMG hard to kill that player and really got my heart pumping, LOL.

    Make all of UO consensual PvP and watch all the PvP die because the only way PvP exists is with LURES  Player V Player is a bullcrap term, it does not exist.
  • TownieTownie Posts: 20
    Bilbo said:
    LMMFAO
    The only reason Fel exists is because of Power Scrolls and the only reason PvP still exists is because of Power Scrolls.  PvP is just the greatest thing in UO is all bullcrap and you know it.  Without the LURES PvP would have died.
    1997 UO was born Fel only

    2000 Tram was born because subs were falling because of the rampant lawlessness.  UO had very little time left because everybody was quitting or had removed there CC data so EA made UO do a quick fix and Tram was the fastest way.  Subs returned and the population grew.

    2002 Power Scrolls and Stat Scrolls  were introduced to Fel because Fel was a ghost town and the PvPers/PKers needed a way to LURE sheep to fel.  Spawns were controlled by Zerg Guilds.

    2003 UO was at its peak with an estimated 350K accounts and Age of Shit was born and UO has been in a downward spiral ever since.

    The only reason people even go to Fel is because of Power Scrolls and double resources not because of PvP.  PKers kill PvMers doing the spawn to steal the power scrolls and call that PvP, LMAO what a load of crap.  If PvP was so great then SP would be the #1 shard in UO.

    There may be some PvMers out there running LOOT programs but why when the EC can do it for you from what I understand but it is almost guaranteed that every PvPer is running illegal programs because that is the only way they can win.

    A person set up to kill another player that is set up to kill a boss is far from PvP but you keep telling people that this is real PvP.  Putting on GM made gear and fight someone with GM made gear was real PvP and what do we have now Gear and programs set up to kill PvMers clearing a spawn now that was so OMG hard to kill that player and really got my heart pumping, LOL.

    Make all of UO consensual PvP and watch all the PvP die because the only way PvP exists is with LURES  Player V Player is a bullcrap term, it does not exist.
    No one plays siege because this is an item based pvp game and siege has no insurance... if your player abilities werent impacted by items any longer siege would be the most active shard.

    Maybe if pvp got some updates more then once every 20 years it would retain its players but nothing has been added to fight for since champion spawns which is real sad when so much more could be done that would breathe life back into pvp
  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    Townie said:
    No one plays siege because this is an item based pvp game and siege has no insurance... if your player abilities werent impacted by items any longer siege would be the most active shard.

    Maybe if pvp got some updates more then once every 20 years it would retain its players but nothing has been added to fight for since champion spawns which is real sad when so much more could be done that would breathe life back into pvp


    This is true.

    I'd really love it if they could realise the full potential of Siege.

    And rescue us off these production shards lol.

    It would have to be updated to current rules maybe. Don't know how Siege players would feel about that?

    Then a 1 way transfer maybe for players wanting to go there? To get fully fledged characters over there? Would you be allowed to take a certain amount of stuff, to get you set up?

    Then after that, they could delete Felucca, and give champion spawns to Trammel.

  • BilboBilbo Posts: 2,834
    edited June 2020
    Townie said:
    Bilbo said:
    LMMFAO
    The only reason Fel exists is because of Power Scrolls and the only reason PvP still exists is because of Power Scrolls.  PvP is just the greatest thing in UO is all bullcrap and you know it.  Without the LURES PvP would have died.
    1997 UO was born Fel only

    2000 Tram was born because subs were falling because of the rampant lawlessness.  UO had very little time left because everybody was quitting or had removed there CC data so EA made UO do a quick fix and Tram was the fastest way.  Subs returned and the population grew.

    2002 Power Scrolls and Stat Scrolls  were introduced to Fel because Fel was a ghost town and the PvPers/PKers needed a way to LURE sheep to fel.  Spawns were controlled by Zerg Guilds.

    2003 UO was at its peak with an estimated 350K accounts and Age of Shit was born and UO has been in a downward spiral ever since.

    The only reason people even go to Fel is because of Power Scrolls and double resources not because of PvP.  PKers kill PvMers doing the spawn to steal the power scrolls and call that PvP, LMAO what a load of crap.  If PvP was so great then SP would be the #1 shard in UO.

    There may be some PvMers out there running LOOT programs but why when the EC can do it for you from what I understand but it is almost guaranteed that every PvPer is running illegal programs because that is the only way they can win.

    A person set up to kill another player that is set up to kill a boss is far from PvP but you keep telling people that this is real PvP.  Putting on GM made gear and fight someone with GM made gear was real PvP and what do we have now Gear and programs set up to kill PvMers clearing a spawn now that was so OMG hard to kill that player and really got my heart pumping, LOL.

    Make all of UO consensual PvP and watch all the PvP die because the only way PvP exists is with LURES  Player V Player is a bullcrap term, it does not exist.
    No one plays siege because this is an item based pvp game and siege has no insurance... if your player abilities werent impacted by items any longer siege would be the most active shard.

    Maybe if pvp got some updates more then once every 20 years it would retain its players but nothing has been added to fight for since champion spawns which is real sad when so much more could be done that would breathe life back into pvp
    Another BS excuses to not do real PvP when real PvP is Player v Player.  Glad you can admit that your real skill at PvP is so far down the scale that you require Gear in order to compete, what a joke.  SP is REAL PvP not this watered down bullcrap.  UO needs to rename PvP to EquipmentPrograms V EquipmentPrograms (EPvEP) and refer to it as game for the skill-less.

    Also TY for admitting that without LURES PvP would be dead.  LMAO  Pre AoS and Scrolls we didn't need a reason to PvP we did it to prove who the better player was, we pitted our skills against another players skills and helped each other to become better players not the bullcrap you call PvP now.

    Funny how all the PvPers now give all the excuses as to how they can't handle real PvP, gotta have those lures/gear/insurance/programs to play a game.
  • drindethdrindeth Posts: 24
    Townie said:

    Maybe if pvp got some updates more then once every 20 years it would retain its players but nothing has been added to fight for since champion spawns which is real sad when so much more could be done that would breathe life back into pvp
    only really commented cus i love ur name bro. ill bet not many people on these forums even knows what a townie is or why without first scouring the interwebs for answers.

    debating with people who are so one sided is absolutly worthless. they cant see past their wierd pacifistic vision of uo where nobody fights anybody and they all sit in luna bank singing cumbaya while taking turns doing champ spawns.

    some day these people will realize that this game needs both pvp and pve to thrive. mabey it will be when EA finally decideds uo doesnt make it enough money and it shitcans it.  its already F2P  and you know what they say about f2p mmos. f2p is the first step to cancellation or death on console. 
  • MerusMerus Posts: 511
    Bilbo said:

    Another BS excuses to not do real PvP when real PvP is Player v Player.  Glad you can admit that your real skill at PvP is so far down the scale that you require Gear in order to compete, what a joke.  SP is REAL PvP not this watered down bullcrap.  UO needs to rename PvP to EquipmentPrograms V EquipmentPrograms (EPvEP) and refer to it as game for the skill-less.

    Also TY for admitting that without LURES PvP would be dead.  LMAO  Pre AoS and Scrolls we didn't need a reason to PvP we did it to prove who the better player was, we pitted our skills against another players skills and helped each other to become better players not the bullcrap you call PvP now.

    Funny how all the PvPers now give all the excuses as to how they can't handle real PvP, gotta have those lures/gear/insurance/programs to play a game.
    And your pvper on Siege is?
  • MissEMissE Posts: 774
    edited June 2020
    I do find it funny all these people saying do tmaps for these scrolls.  I ONLY do fel tmaps, and only for that reason, however, other than miasma's chance of dropping a fel hoard map, the others are like damn hens teeth to amass. I am not talking about 1-2  a week, when I do tmaps I wanna do 10-20 or more at a time.  There is zero source for those kinda numbers since they destroyed tmapping.   Other maps are not really even worth doing these days.  Trying to find a source for a regular supply of fel maps is next to impossible so getting 2-3 scrolls 105/110 out of one map if means you need to complete HUNDREDS until you get enough 105's to bind up to a 110 then more hundreds to get from 110 to 115 and probably 500 or more to get that 120.  

    As I said I ONLY do fel tmaps and have farmed and farmed all manor of creatures trying to build up a supply of them and that is impossible.   I even went so far to placing a building in fel to dump down a couple of skull rugs but they tend to drop 80% stash and supply maps with only the odd cache and you need cache and above to get any scrolls. So then you dig up the lower level crap maps on the hope that they will spawn a higher level in them of which 95% of the time they don't.

    So yeah not a great solution unless anyone can tell me where I can spend a short amount of time farming cache or higher maps.  By the time you spend 2-3 hours farming trash mobs for 1 or 2 maps when you need HUNDREDS for it to be effective then come tell me again how this is a solution for pet scrolls when most of us want scrolls for 20 + pets.

    Cheers MissE

    For more info about Angelwood Warehouse Events go to the A.W.E Forum
  • CookieCookie Posts: 913
    MissE said:
    I do find it funny all these people saying do tmaps for these scrolls.  I ONLY do fel tmaps, and only for that reason, however, other than miasma's chance of dropping a fel hoard map, the others are like damn hens teeth to amass. I am not talking about 1-2  a week, when I do tmaps I wanna do 10-20 or more at a time.  There is zero source for those kinda numbers since they destroyed tmapping.   Other maps are not really even worth doing these days.  Trying to find a source for a regular supply of fel maps is next to impossible so getting 2-3 scrolls 105/110 out of one map if means you need to complete HUNDREDS until you get enough 105's to bind up to a 110 then more hundreds to get from 110 to 115 and probably 500 or more to get that 120.  

    As I said I ONLY do fel tmaps and have farmed and farmed all manor of creatures trying to build up a supply of them and that is impossible.   I even went so far to placing a building in fel to dump down a couple of skull rugs but they tend to drop 80% stash and supply maps with only the odd cache and you need cache and above to get any scrolls. So then you dig up the lower level crap maps on the hope that they will spawn a higher level in them of which 95% of the time they don't.

    So yeah not a great solution unless anyone can tell me where I can spend a short amount of time farming cache or higher maps.  By the time you spend 2-3 hours farming trash mobs for 1 or 2 maps when you need HUNDREDS for it to be effective then come tell me again how this is a solution for pet scrolls when most of us want scrolls for 20 + pets.
    Hi MissE,

    I do get your problem, I only do Felucca Tmaps myself, and I have farmed everything to get them. Whilst they do seem to drop, the drop rates are insanely low. For example, I do Balrons at the bottom of Hyloth, nothing drops for days, then my friend gets one in 45 minutes... I do Blood Ellie’s in Wind, I’m sure I’ve had one there before, but again unbelievably low drop rate, I cant make it happen often.

    Ultimately, I do Miasma, and I get 1 chest drop every 60k gold say, which is say 20-30 minutes, so let’s say 3 an hour. Then the Felucca map drop is a 1 out of 6 facet drop chance, but in reality it is 1 in 10 drop chance, so you get one on average every 2 hours, or worse. I actually enjoy farming Miasma just because, and I do build up huge quantities, and often never get round to doing the maps myself, so give away say 50 at a time. But I’m one of the few who can say they do this, or enjoy it, I just like relaxed farming. Again in my opinion, because of hyper gold inflation etc. No one is interested in basic gathering anymore, there is no perceived value in it, they would all rather the 250m cameo hit. I burn all the rest of the maps for cleanup points :)

    So yes, I do get the problem. I do wish they could find a way to boost normal dungeon gathering, spread the rewards out there.
  • Garth_GreyGarth_Grey Posts: 1,175
    Get a Triton ....nuff said.
    You and Several Others like this.


    Please make the Grizzled Mare a 5 slot mount, it's incredibly rare and deserves it.
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,026
    edited June 2020
    Get a Triton ....nuff said.
    Well, with a Triton one can save the powerscrolls for Resist and Wrestling but, depending on the build, other Powerscrolls could still be needed....

    Furthermore, there is no pet that can do it all so, just like a Dexer needs to have several Weapons, and a Mageseveral spellbooks depending on the Hunt, so a Tamer needs several, different pets, depending on the Hunt....

    So, Powerscrolls are much in need for Tamers, me thinks....
  • MerusMerus Posts: 511
    Cookie said:
    MissE said:
    I do find it funny all these people saying do tmaps for these scrolls.  I ONLY do fel tmaps, and only for that reason, however, other than miasma's chance of dropping a fel hoard map, the others are like damn hens teeth to amass. I am not talking about 1-2  a week, when I do tmaps I wanna do 10-20 or more at a time.  There is zero source for those kinda numbers since they destroyed tmapping.   Other maps are not really even worth doing these days.  Trying to find a source for a regular supply of fel maps is next to impossible so getting 2-3 scrolls 105/110 out of one map if means you need to complete HUNDREDS until you get enough 105's to bind up to a 110 then more hundreds to get from 110 to 115 and probably 500 or more to get that 120.  

    As I said I ONLY do fel tmaps and have farmed and farmed all manor of creatures trying to build up a supply of them and that is impossible.   I even went so far to placing a building in fel to dump down a couple of skull rugs but they tend to drop 80% stash and supply maps with only the odd cache and you need cache and above to get any scrolls. So then you dig up the lower level crap maps on the hope that they will spawn a higher level in them of which 95% of the time they don't.

    So yeah not a great solution unless anyone can tell me where I can spend a short amount of time farming cache or higher maps.  By the time you spend 2-3 hours farming trash mobs for 1 or 2 maps when you need HUNDREDS for it to be effective then come tell me again how this is a solution for pet scrolls when most of us want scrolls for 20 + pets.
    Hi MissE,

    I do get your problem, I only do Felucca Tmaps myself, and I have farmed everything to get them. Whilst they do seem to drop, the drop rates are insanely low. For example, I do Balrons at the bottom of Hyloth, nothing drops for days, then my friend gets one in 45 minutes... I do Blood Ellie’s in Wind, I’m sure I’ve had one there before, but again unbelievably low drop rate, I cant make it happen often.

    Ultimately, I do Miasma, and I get 1 chest drop every 60k gold say, which is say 20-30 minutes, so let’s say 3 an hour. Then the Felucca map drop is a 1 out of 6 facet drop chance, but in reality it is 1 in 10 drop chance, so you get one on average every 2 hours, or worse. I actually enjoy farming Miasma just because, and I do build up huge quantities, and often never get round to doing the maps myself, so give away say 50 at a time. But I’m one of the few who can say they do this, or enjoy it, I just like relaxed farming. Again in my opinion, because of hyper gold inflation etc. No one is interested in basic gathering anymore, there is no perceived value in it, they would all rather the 250m cameo hit. I burn all the rest of the maps for cleanup points :)

    So yes, I do get the problem. I do wish they could find a way to boost normal dungeon gathering, spread the rewards out there.
    I believe every facet deserves a place or two which are similar to the dark guardian room.
  • drindethdrindeth Posts: 24
    tamers were never suppose to be easy or cheap to make.
    because of the ease of use, i believe having to dump gold into them is a good thing. 
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,026
    edited June 2020
    drindeth said:
    tamers were never suppose to be easy or cheap to make.
    because of the ease of use, i believe having to dump gold into them is a good thing. 
    Uhu ?

    "Dump" gold into pets ?

    Really ?

    With what many 120s needed by pets cost, a fully scrolled Pet can easily cost hundreds of millions of gold points....

    Multiply that for several pets and we are talking of platinums spent in a Tamer's stable....

    Maybe others might think it is normal and acceptable, I happen to think it is not.

    When the cost of scrolling a pet gets "that" high because Powerscrolls are held hostage by a handfull of player because of whatever the mechanics to get them are that cause a Monopoly for them, not to mention having multiple pets in a Tamer's stables, it can become a game stopper for a Tamer player which is just not right, to my opinion. 
  • jelinidasjelinidas Posts: 324
    Popps, to my opinion, a tamer is not for you.
  • TimStTimSt Posts: 1,466
    MissE said:
    I do find it funny all these people saying do tmaps for these scrolls.  I ONLY do fel tmaps, and only for that reason, however, other than miasma's chance of dropping a fel hoard map, the others are like damn hens teeth to amass. I am not talking about 1-2  a week, when I do tmaps I wanna do 10-20 or more at a time.  There is zero source for those kinda numbers since they destroyed tmapping.   Other maps are not really even worth doing these days.  Trying to find a source for a regular supply of fel maps is next to impossible so getting 2-3 scrolls 105/110 out of one map if means you need to complete HUNDREDS until you get enough 105's to bind up to a 110 then more hundreds to get from 110 to 115 and probably 500 or more to get that 120.  

    As I said I ONLY do fel tmaps and have farmed and farmed all manor of creatures trying to build up a supply of them and that is impossible.   I even went so far to placing a building in fel to dump down a couple of skull rugs but they tend to drop 80% stash and supply maps with only the odd cache and you need cache and above to get any scrolls. So then you dig up the lower level crap maps on the hope that they will spawn a higher level in them of which 95% of the time they don't.

    So yeah not a great solution unless anyone can tell me where I can spend a short amount of time farming cache or higher maps.  By the time you spend 2-3 hours farming trash mobs for 1 or 2 maps when you need HUNDREDS for it to be effective then come tell me again how this is a solution for pet scrolls when most of us want scrolls for 20 + pets.
    If you don't mind starting with stash maps and progressing to higher level maps you can farm tmaps using the treasure quest from the town cryer. When I was farming them I was getting 23 stash maps a week and progressing through the various levels.
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