Stealing from Monsters at the Underwater Boss... perhaps it needs a boost ?

poppspopps Posts: 3,981
edited May 19 in General Discussions

I have tried to steal from the Underwater Boss, one of the toughest Bosses in the game as it requires a very large Party to be fought... I was expecting generous Rewards from stealing from it but I was greatly disappointed when I saw that all I got was a few random scrolls (magic scrolls, sometimes magery sometimes necromancy scrolls) of no or little value and, also, the steal only worked once per Boss...

Excuse me ?

In between the time to gather all 4 keys and the Party (and time) needed to fight this Boss because of its toughness all one gets from stealing from it is a few of no or little value magic scrolls, and only once per Boss ?

@Kyronix , do we want stealing to be a viable gameplay, at least in PvM ?

Because it does not look to me it is worth the trouble, as it is...

Comments

  • MariahMariah Posts: 3,040Moderator
    Perhaps you should read more about stealing from monsters?
    to quote pertinent sections:
    A given monster can be stolen from once in its lifetime

    • Players cannot steal twice from the same monster
    • Rare items only drop in Fel Dungeons and Champ Spawn areas (all facets)

  • poppspopps Posts: 3,981
    Mariah said:
    Perhaps you should read more about stealing from monsters?
    to quote pertinent sections:
    A given monster can be stolen from once in its lifetime

    • Players cannot steal twice from the same monster
    • Rare items only drop in Fel Dungeons and Champ Spawn areas (all facets)

    I know that... but I highlighted that this was stealing from the Underwater Boss... which is an entire other ballpark as the other Monsters, to suggest that perhaps, stealing from "higher up" Bosses even when not in Felucca Dungeons/Champ Spawns, should yield better stuff and possibly make it also possible to steal multple times from them ?

    This, to my opinion, if we want stealing, at least in PvM, to have an actual use...
  • Victim_Of_SiegeVictim_Of_Siege Posts: 1,918
    popps said:
    Mariah said:
    Perhaps you should read more about stealing from monsters?
    to quote pertinent sections:
    A given monster can be stolen from once in its lifetime

    • Players cannot steal twice from the same monster
    • Rare items only drop in Fel Dungeons and Champ Spawn areas (all facets)

    I know that... but I highlighted that this was stealing from the Underwater Boss... which is an entire other ballpark as the other Monsters, to suggest that perhaps, stealing from "higher up" Bosses even when not in Felucca Dungeons/Champ Spawns, should yield better stuff and possibly make it also possible to steal multple times from them ?

    This, to my opinion, if we want stealing, at least in PvM, to have an actual use...
    It has one, you get lanterns, gold, Exodus Rites pieces, Steal only artifact pieces, and lots more. If you would like to add more, send it to the team instead of trying to offer up a bunch of BS about how it doesn't work or isn't worth it (it does work and it is worth it.) At least, this is how I see it, To my opinion. 
    A Goblin, a Gargoyle, and a Drow walk into a bar . . .

    Never be afraid to challenge the status quo

  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,240
    Mariah said:
    Perhaps you should read more about stealing from monsters?
    to quote pertinent sections:
    A given monster can be stolen from once in its lifetime

    • Players cannot steal twice from the same monster
    • Rare items only drop in Fel Dungeons and Champ Spawn areas (all facets)

    I can confirm this is how it works as I went out with my thief and did this a few times. So to that piece of this thread I'd say <in my Dev voice> everything is working as intended. It makes sense players cannot steal more than once from monsters because that could see how quickly that could be abused.

    That said, I do see where popps is coming from on general idea because I've also thought to myself when I've gone into Fel and tried to steal from spawn champ and only gotten like 150gp and thought to myself "wow that's it?". 

    I think it's part of a bigger issue with the stealing skill and the lagging of content for a pure rogue. I've suggested to the Dev team things to help include rogues into the fold of things for a change of pace (like allowing ToT items to be stolen from monsters etc) but I think it's probably a good amount of time/logic that would be needed.
  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 1,391
    I've done quite a lot of stealing from monsters, but I tend to do it where the publish notes tell me it will work. 
    https://studio.youtube.com/playlist/PLprHlGS_hZUTIuFlVVJOAz67tnnQ5Asyw/edit

  • poppspopps Posts: 3,981
    edited May 19
    I seem to remember from a good while back (tried to look for that post but could not find it... perhaps my memory fails me and I am not remembering it well ?), that perhaps Kyronix posted in a Thread about Rogues that the Developers had in mind some ideas for thieves/rogues... I hope that eventually such an update will see the light, at least in regards to stealing from Monsters and in PvM in general...
  • UrgeUrge Posts: 1,238
    That was 3+ years ago when kyronix tossed out the rogue + crafter future update. 

    I've made plats with my thief doing VvV and getting lucky stealing scrolls at spawns. 

    Would I like some better content? Absolutely. Do you need it to make bank with a thief? Nope.
  • JackFlashUkJackFlashUk Posts: 950
    so this is the reason why you always fail at new events.......


    You spend more time here moaning, and then do some other random thing to create mass-debate topics

    Why are you not getting hats?

  • Victim_Of_SiegeVictim_Of_Siege Posts: 1,918
    so this is the reason why you always fail at new events.......


    You spend more time here moaning, and then do some other random thing to create mass-debate topics

    Why are you not getting hats?

    Heck,  I bet even he has collected thousands upon thousands of them like the rest of us. Even Void Pool on Atlantic is getiing thin with participants.
    A Goblin, a Gargoyle, and a Drow walk into a bar . . .

    Never be afraid to challenge the status quo

  • JackFlashUkJackFlashUk Posts: 950
    edited May 20
    so this is the reason why you always fail at new events.......


    You spend more time here moaning, and then do some other random thing to create mass-debate topics

    Why are you not getting hats?

    Heck,  I bet even he has collected thousands upon thousands of them like the rest of us. Even Void Pool on Atlantic is getiing thin with participants.
    guarantee he is, not judging by the stupid questions....

    As soon as the dungeon dried out of players doing the work, the entrance spammers,   which I bet Popps was one cried and stayed at home moaning

    edited by Mariah to correct spelling error.


  • ForeverFunForeverFun Posts: 852

    Taking a thief to this boss fight isn't exactly pulling your own weight as it relates to team contribution.

    This thread is light on specifics as it relates to what the proposed change would be.

    For starters, the loot that people go to UW for is generated when the boss dies.

    Let's play out if corpse loot wasn't generated at death, but instead is generated when the mob is created, and any/all of that could be stolen while the monster is alive.  I'm sure that would go over well with the other players to have an empty corpse at death.  Amusing, sure.

    Are you hoping to steal some super rare thing?  Otherwise, it's far easier to steal from mobs at champ spawns.  I've seen one spawn in particular that is frequented by some thiefs that appear to never rest.
  • UrgeUrge Posts: 1,238

    Are you hoping to steal some super rare thing?  Otherwise, it's far easier to steal from mobs at champ spawns.  I've seen one spawn in particular that is frequented by some thiefs that appear to never rest.

    I didn't know there was anything worth stealing? Actual thieves or maybe setting spawn cams up?
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,981
    edited May 21

    Taking a thief to this boss fight isn't exactly pulling your own weight as it relates to team contribution.

    This thread is light on specifics as it relates to what the proposed change would be.

    For starters, the loot that people go to UW for is generated when the boss dies.

    Let's play out if corpse loot wasn't generated at death, but instead is generated when the mob is created, and any/all of that could be stolen while the monster is alive.  I'm sure that would go over well with the other players to have an empty corpse at death.  Amusing, sure.

    Are you hoping to steal some super rare thing?  Otherwise, it's far easier to steal from mobs at champ spawns.  I've seen one spawn in particular that is frequented by some thiefs that appear to never rest.
    Well, aside from the rare artifacts, the Underwater Boss drops Legendary items as Loot... 

    How about the thief was given the ability to steal random Legendary items with a higher end quality?

    Considering that each character having looting rights can get tens of Legendary items in his/her instanced loot corpse, I would not see it as a problem to allow a thief to be able to steal from the Underwater Boss a higher end quality Legendary item....

    Perhaps, it would not be necessary to change loot generation from death of the Boss to the spawning of the Boss but only, make a specialty case for stealing from a Boss... when the steal is attempted, the engine creates an item with properties that is separate from the Boss death corpse loot... it is a bonus, an item created extra for the stealing gameplay.
  • Victim_Of_SiegeVictim_Of_Siege Posts: 1,918
    edited May 21
    popps said:

    Taking a thief to this boss fight isn't exactly pulling your own weight as it relates to team contribution.

    This thread is light on specifics as it relates to what the proposed change would be.

    For starters, the loot that people go to UW for is generated when the boss dies.

    Let's play out if corpse loot wasn't generated at death, but instead is generated when the mob is created, and any/all of that could be stolen while the monster is alive.  I'm sure that would go over well with the other players to have an empty corpse at death.  Amusing, sure.

    Are you hoping to steal some super rare thing?  Otherwise, it's far easier to steal from mobs at champ spawns.  I've seen one spawn in particular that is frequented by some thiefs that appear to never rest.
    Well, aside from the rare artifacts, the Underwater Boss drops Legendary items as Loot... 

    How about the thief was given the ability to steal random Legendary items with a higher end quality?

    Considering that each character having looting rights can get tens of Legendary items in his/her instanced loot corpse, I would not see it as a problem to allow a thief to be able to steal from the Underwater Boss a higher end quality Legendary item....

    Perhaps, it would not be necessary to change loot generation from death of the Boss to the spawning of the Boss but only, make a specialty case for stealing from a Boss... when the steal is attempted, the engine creates an item with properties that is separate from the Boss death corpse loot... it is a bonus, an item created extra for the stealing gameplay.



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    A Goblin, a Gargoyle, and a Drow walk into a bar . . .

    Never be afraid to challenge the status quo

  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 1,391
    Many, many *cough* many years ago (pre AoS) my husband had a thief character, it was at that time possible to steal the mob's actual loot. People hunting the lich in the forest near Yew became really cross when they found the lich they just killed had no loot left. Nick Delute had nicked the loot :D
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,240
    Urge said:

    Are you hoping to steal some super rare thing?  Otherwise, it's far easier to steal from mobs at champ spawns.  I've seen one spawn in particular that is frequented by some thiefs that appear to never rest.

    I didn't know there was anything worth stealing? Actual thieves or maybe setting spawn cams up?
    Thieves can steal seeds of life and the +10 mana / +10 stam potions from champ spawn creatures. Last I checked, seeds of life were selling for 1m on VS on ATL.
  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 1,391
    You can steal:
    • Special potions etc from champ spawns or Felucca dungeons. I like elder gazers in Hythloth because they don't have an awful lot of 'other' things on the stealable list - see my vid.
    • Exodus keys and ML ingredients from Exodus zealots, and a thief with detect can find the hidden boxes there for keys, essences, small gems, parasitic poison pots and smoke bombs - my other vid.
    • Detect items in Khaldun dungeon from boxes and solve puzzle chests
    • Detect boxes in Kotl city under Eodon.
    • Steal refinements from town shops
    That's without even thinking about the various decorative items that can be stolen in Doom, Wrong, Fan Dancers, Yomotsu dungeon.

    I don't really do pvp, but I did, when researching to write about it, manage to steal VvV town sigils without getting caught.
  • UrgeUrge Posts: 1,238
    keven2002 said:
    Urge said:

    Are you hoping to steal some super rare thing?  Otherwise, it's far easier to steal from mobs at champ spawns.  I've seen one spawn in particular that is frequented by some thiefs that appear to never rest.

    I didn't know there was anything worth stealing? Actual thieves or maybe setting spawn cams up?
    Thieves can steal seeds of life and the +10 mana / +10 stam potions from champ spawn creatures. Last I checked, seeds of life were selling for 1m on VS on ATL.

    Thanks. I knew about the potions but not the seeds. 
  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 1,391
    The underwater boss is a group encounter, a thief is usually sadly lacking in combat ability, and would therefore be a 'passenger' in such a group. I don't think that would be welcome. Steal somewhere you're supposed to steal instead.
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,981
    edited May 23
    The underwater boss is a group encounter, a thief is usually sadly lacking in combat ability, and would therefore be a 'passenger' in such a group. I don't think that would be welcome. Steal somewhere you're supposed to steal instead.
    I beg your pardon but isn't that the case with any spawn, even those where the thief is supposed to steal from MOBs ?

    I see no difference at all.

    What I see, is a very much limited capacity for the Stealing from Monsters gameplay whereas it is currently severely limited to only a few Monsters rather then any and all Monsters as, to my opinion, it should be.
  • GrimbeardGrimbeard Posts: 2,141
    edited May 23
    Ok popps if you provide screenshots of your thief skills and them snooping the UWB pack your changes will be implemented 
  • RorschachRorschach Posts: 510Moderator
    This thread is closed.
This discussion has been closed.