Macer Builds?

I did some poking around in threads for info on how best to build a macer for PvM but what I found wasn't very specific. They seemed to be threads that were more about dex/stam gear from past events that were wished for again, etc.

Can anyone point me to threads more along the lines of how to best build the macer to begin with and how you might best craft your own suit if you don't have event items?

The last macer I had was when weapons of vanquishing were a thing. This is where I'm headed...
I've scrolled everything to 120 because I wasn't really sure which I could effectively go lower on. 
I've maxed my stats.
I used a III mace mastery but I'm not at 90 skill yet. So, I don't even know what that will bring.
Should I use other masteries?

Should I only craft weapons with WW on them? Speaking of which, I'm only a couple days old finding out a staff doesn't offer a WW attack. What weapon would be better than a staff for WW? That seems odd to me.

Do I have to cram as much luck on gear as possible?

Use jewels for +15 on a couple skills and add as much SSI, and Stam and Mana regen to gear as I can?  Is this build headed anywhere other than the wrong direction?

Do I need a better shield than this?...
:D I'm kiddin

Thanks for any advice offered.



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Comments

  • MerlinMerlin Posts: 211
    I have a Mace and Shield Paladin Warrior which runs the following:  
    120 Mace Fighting 
    120 Tactics 
    100 Parrying 
    120 Chivalry 
    090 Healing 
    090 Anatomy 
    080 Resist Spells  

    I run with slayer sets of Barbed Whips and Hammer Picks for weapons. Human race. Suit is all plate/ring for stamina protection. 190+ stam, 149 hit points. 15 HPR, 15 MR. I recently revamped this character from Swords and Bone/Stud to Macing with the Plate and I've been enjoying it.  I have a pretty Uber shield to make it work to hit all the mods I am aiming for. That's pretty important for any template with a Shield. You can find a good shield for pretty cheap, but getting a top end shield can be a game changer for a build like this.
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    Wow! Thank you for taking the time to share this! I'll keep working at it.
  • CovenantXCovenantX Posts: 949
    edited March 30
    I'd drop focus for resist with LMC & Mana leech on a weapon you won't have mana issues.

    and yes to a better shield,  FC 1 SSI 10%  anything else is a bonus.

     I generally use reforged wooden shields with 5 Hci, 25 DI & 10 SSI, then imbue Fc1 & 15 DCI on it, then enhance with bloodwood for hpr2 & 40 luck.
    Remove or change casting focus & poison immunity it reduces the need for "Player Skill" it's garbage. rant2 Bring timing back and eliminate chance in pvp!
    ICQ# 478 633 659
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    Nice! Thank you....I was just sort of flying by the seat of my pants, figuring with focus being found under combat and reading that a macer needs stam and mana regen that focus would be useful.

    And I guess I was wrongly under the impression that resist was more useful in PvP than in PvM.

    Thanks for the help and advice. Much appreciated.
  • looploop Posts: 331
    Alternative to the paladin & shield template is just a straight samurai with macing:

    Mace 120
    Tactics 120
    Bushido 120
    Resist 120
    Heal 100
    Anatomy 100
    Parry 100

    I enjoy this more than Sampire. Black staff or war hammer for whirlwind.

  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    That looks like it could be fun too...thanks, Loop!
  • PlayerSkillFTWPlayerSkillFTW Posts: 542
    edited March 30
    My Macer/Paladin on Atlantic has...

    120 Macing
    120 Chivalry (can actually drop this to 105 and up Resist to 95 if you have Gloves of the Holy Warrior)
    GM Tact
    GM Anat
    GM Healing
    GM Parry
    80 Resist

    I use Barbed Whips for WW, Hammer Picks for AI, and Mauls for DS. I have a really powerful no-name Legendary shield that i use.

    The Macer/Paladin excels in 1v1 fights against hard hitting foes. The Stagger ability applies a -60% SSI debuff for 10 secs (which can be refreshed and be active on multiple targets if you're good at swapping target to Stagger), which oftentimes allows you to 4 sec self bandage heal between the enemies' swings, especially when used in combination with a Hit Fatigue weapon. Stagger+Hit Fatigue basically neuters the melee damage output of virtually any foe. The Macer/Paladin can tank Life-Leech immune foes that would send most Sword Sampires running and screaming.

    The Macer/Paladin just doesn't perform as well as a Sampire though when fighting swarms of opponents, due to bandy healing not being able to keep up with all the incoming damage and potential interruptions from poison spam.
    During the ToT events however, i'll sometimes swap the GM Parry for GM Necro, and go into Vampire Form, and then be able to take on both swarms of enemies, as well as single heavy hitters.
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    edited March 30
    I found this shield today. I just hit 90 mace and a moment ago took the mastery icons out to see what I could see. I saw Stagger and Toughness. I'm using this sledge atm while training. Haven't had crafter make anything yet.


    I have a macro set for nearest hostile target but don't have a macro for toggling to different targets (if there is such a thing). But I could clumsily pull health bars to switch. lol

    I'm continuing to let Focus raise, figuring I've come this far I might as well raise it and stone it in case it comes in handy for some other build. Then I'll go work on resist.

    Raising Resist, is this primarily to keep curse spells at bay?

    Edited to say - I did wonder at a Necro / Macer. In my minds eye tho, I see her as a Paladin. Mayhap she'll fall under a wicked curse someday and become a necromancer.

    Thanks, All, for offering information to consider on various builds. It's super helpful for someone whose forte isn't this. But I can decorate the bajeezus out of a keep or 18x18. 
    :0)

  • CovenantXCovenantX Posts: 949
    Resist is mainly to prevent mana drain & mana vamp from taking all your mana, which is the leading cause of death in pvm!  -will prevent you from being paralyzed against most mobs as well.

    My sampires are basically the same template as in the OP with Resist instead of Focus & Necromancy instead of Parry.   (I use Cuffs of the Arch-mage for +15 resist, locked real skill at 95 so I'm 110 resist, Both my jewelry are imbued

    15 Hci
    25 DI
    10 SSI
    10 Chivalry
    1 FC  (if you have enough FC (2 FC should be enough) it won't add swing delay to your attacks when you cast Consecrate Weapon, Divine Fury or Enemy of One)

    Macing Mastery
    Remove or change casting focus & poison immunity it reduces the need for "Player Skill" it's garbage. rant2 Bring timing back and eliminate chance in pvp!
    ICQ# 478 633 659
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    Awesome stuff!  :) thanks!
  • UrgeUrge Posts: 1,233
    I have a shield swords guy but i run vamp form and healing. It's pretty tanky.
  • RadstRadst Posts: 98
    I have seen so many discussions on those "dragoon" or macer builds, but haven't seen any real videos to demonstrate its effectiveness as a go-to build. Talk of only templates and gear is just too linear.

    So I invite those above to record your solo fights against:
    Dragon Turtle spawn
    Shimmering Effusion
    Putrefier
    Paroxysmus
    Scalis

    You should be able to handle these targets with ease & efficiency. 5 minutes tops, except Scalis.

    Lets see some videos.
  • GrimbeardGrimbeard Posts: 2,120
    Radst said:
    I have seen so many discussions on those "dragoon" or macer builds, but haven't seen any real videos to demonstrate its effectiveness as a go-to build. Talk of only templates and gear is just too linear.

    So I invite those above to record your solo fights against:
    Dragon Turtle spawn
    Shimmering Effusion
    Putrefier
    Paroxysmus
    Scalis

    You should be able to handle these targets with ease & efficiency. 5 minutes tops, except Scalis.

    Lets see some videos.
    Killing monsters like guitar playing isn't a race the strength of a macer is stagger and the ability to go toe to toe with everything 
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    loop said:
    Alternative to the paladin & shield template is just a straight samurai with macing:

    Mace 120
    Tactics 120
    Bushido 120
    Resist 120
    Heal 100
    Anatomy 100
    Parry 100

    I enjoy this more than Sampire. Black staff or war hammer for whirlwind.


    Rereading everything here...lots to digest. Loop, I see where you're saying a Black Staff does offer WW attack. But then I started thinking, wait, if you're using a staff does Parry go out the window?

    Does having Parry work in an other way or in combination with any other skill (Bushido?) without having a shield in your hand?

    Thanks @Urge , I'll look into the idea of a Samp-y macer too. I may end up having to build two! :D
  • Petra_FydePetra_Fyde Posts: 1,386
    Interesting.  I don't have a macer, but I do make low level slayer weapons for newbies and returners. Currently I've been making war axe and black staff for macers. Am I making the wrong items?
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,240
    LilyGrace said:
    Does having Parry work in an other way or in combination with any other skill (Bushido?) without having a shield in your hand?

    The strength of a Sampire is that Parry + Bushido is stronger with a 2 handed weapon versus using a 1 hander + shield.

    I do believe that using a 2 handed weapon without Bushido (but with parry) will still proc the skill but it won't be as effective as a 1 hander + shield.
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    edited March 31
    Right right...thanks for the refresher on that, Kev

    Edited to add: Just used Stagger for the first time. Oof!  >:)
  • RadstRadst Posts: 98
    Everything is really centered around Weapon Special Moves. Why? Because it has been unbalanced since day1.

    Swords is the winner here: you need only Bladed Staff (Armor Ignore) & Double Axe (Double Strike & WW)

    You cannot do so with other builds. You'll have to carry THREE weapons.
  • GrimbeardGrimbeard Posts: 2,120
    I run 
    120 mace
    120 tactics 
    120 anatomy 
    120 healing 
    120 resisting 
    120 chivalry 
    I use the sweet new mace weapon for general purpose Killing
    Then slayer mauls as a pally using Consecrate I don't need 100 elemental weapons 
    You can easily go toe to toe vs the toughest paragons..


  • CovenantXCovenantX Posts: 949
    Interesting.  I don't have a macer, but I do make low level slayer weapons for newbies and returners. Currently I've been making war axe and black staff for macers. Am I making the wrong items?
       I'd say they're good for mid-lower end suits, once you get enough stamina & SSI, the war axe would be replaced with a hammer pick (higher base dmg AI weapon), a bit slower though.

      My samp doesn't have parry or bushido, so I opt for a Whip/Hammer Pick/Maul weapons. and use a shield for more mods, I'm 4/0 FC/FCR so I can heal/cure quick with chivalry if need be (normally only in pvp situations) as bandaids & vamp form are plenty for pvm cause you can actually hit mobs.... averaging 3/1 swings per hit to another player -see parry (pvp)



    Remove or change casting focus & poison immunity it reduces the need for "Player Skill" it's garbage. rant2 Bring timing back and eliminate chance in pvp!
    ICQ# 478 633 659
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    Grimbeard said:
    I run 
    120 mace
    120 tactics 
    120 anatomy 
    120 healing 
    120 resisting 
    120 chivalry 
    I use the sweet new mace weapon for general purpose Killing
    Then slayer mauls as a pally using Consecrate I don't need 100 elemental weapons 
    You can easily go toe to toe vs the toughest paragons..



    nice
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,240
    This is a little off topic from macing but is a question about the bashing ability on a pet. Would this be the sort of thing you could put on a vollem (as a Sampire) for the pet to proc stagger? I know some masteries on pets don't have great AI; I was wondering if this would be one of them.
  • LilyGraceLilyGrace Posts: 798
    Well shucks, I was hoping someone was going to have an answer for you, Keven. I was really curious about the vollem. 
  • CovenantXCovenantX Posts: 949
    edited April 2
    Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

    cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc
    the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.
    Remove or change casting focus & poison immunity it reduces the need for "Player Skill" it's garbage. rant2 Bring timing back and eliminate chance in pvp!
    ICQ# 478 633 659
  • PlayerSkillFTWPlayerSkillFTW Posts: 542
    Radst said:
    I have seen so many discussions on those "dragoon" or macer builds, but haven't seen any real videos to demonstrate its effectiveness as a go-to build. Talk of only templates and gear is just too linear.

    So I invite those above to record your solo fights against:
    Dragon Turtle spawn
    Shimmering Effusion
    Putrefier
    Paroxysmus
    Scalis

    You should be able to handle these targets with ease & efficiency. 5 minutes tops, except Scalis.

    Lets see some videos.

    During the Treasures of Ice Event, my Macer/Paladin was able to take on two Paragon AOLs at the same time (due to me keeping both under Stagger), when even just one Para AOL would send Swords Sampires running. Para WWs as well.
    During Treasures of Deceit, i was taking on a Para LL and Para Ossein Ram at the same time (keeping both under Stagger, while focusing DS spam against the LL while keeping Toughness up).
    During Treasures of Fire/Hythloth, i could take on a Para Balron or Para Succubus 1v1 and win (some jousting against the Para Balrons until my Hit Fatigue could bring down their Stamina, then they were much easier).
    During Treasures of Destard, i could 1v1 the Para Shadow Wyrms, just had to be quick with Remove Curse/Apple when Blood Oathed, and prepare a Close Wounds as soon as i heard the Dragon Breath roar.
    During Treasures of Tokuno, could 1v1 the Para Skeletal Dragons, with the same tactics as i used against the Para Shadow Wyrms.

    CovenantX said:
    Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

    cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc
    the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

    Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.
  • keven2002keven2002 Posts: 2,240
    PlayerSkillFTW said:
    CovenantX said:
    Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

    cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc
    the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

    Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.

    @PlayerSkillFTW - Do you find the Disco + AP to be more effective than stagger when using a vollem?
  • poppspopps Posts: 3,979
    edited April 3

    CovenantX said:
    Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

    cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc
    the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

    Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.
    How do you keep the Vollem alive, though, without having veterinary ?

    I doubt that the Chivalry Close Wounds spell can be of much help... sure, if the Dexer goes first and tanks the MoB, then the Vollem would not take damage but, Monsters retarget so, even if the Dexer goes first to tank the MoB, there is always the chance that the Vollem gets attacked by the MoB and, if it is a tough BOSS, a few hits could be enough to kill the Vollem...

    So, may I ask how you manage to keep the Vollem alive ? Thanks.
  • WhitewolfWhitewolf Posts: 192
    popps said:

    CovenantX said:
    Bashing for stagger on pets for use with a sampire wouldn't be worth it tbh. you'd be better off using macing yourself and just run with a beetle for rune corruption.

    cause if you level a pet up to add that ability, you'll need taming & lore to control it at that point, so you'd be looking at something with tons of skill increase.. and that's likely going to make it very hard to get a high-stat suit useful for a sampire, just to use pets for the random chance at stagger etc
    the  rune corruption, would be more useful since a beetle can be made to use only that, instead of wasting mana on other things that won't compliment your attacks.

    Vollems start with -18 Taming Requirement, and so long as you keep it at 30.0 or below during the pet leveling process, anyone can control them. Most of my dexxers have a Vollem leveled once and given 120 Disco+AP. The Disco significantly debuffs the victim's offense and defense, and the AP debuff makes the victim take +10% more damage from all sources for 3 seconds.
    How do you keep the Vollem alive, though, without having veterinary ?

    I doubt that the Chivalry Close Wounds spell can be of much help... sure, if the Dexer goes first and tanks the MoB, then the Vollem would not take damage but, Monsters retarget so, even if the Dexer goes first to tank the MoB, there is always the chance that the Vollem gets attacked by the MoB and, if it is a tough BOSS, a few hits could be enough to kill the Vollem...

    So, may I ask how you manage to keep the Vollem alive ? Thanks.
    well obviously your not goin to use a vollem for everything, i use one on my sampire, but only for certain mobs that i know won't retarget it, like when im farming unbound vortexs for orbs
  • WhitewolfWhitewolf Posts: 192
    i been working on a macer/paladin myself, this post has been very helpful so thank you, i have always prefered dexxers over caster, i have 2 sampires, 1 swords 1 fencing. and then i have a fencer/poisoner and now ill have my macer/paladin. but for the macer what mastery do you guys normal use? 
  • GrimbeardGrimbeard Posts: 2,120
    i been working on a macer/paladin myself, this post has been very helpful so thank you, i have always prefered dexxers over caster, i have 2 sampires, 1 swords 1 fencing. and then i have a fencer/poisoner and now ill have my macer/paladin. but for the macer what mastery do you guys normal use? 
    Macing stagger is incredible 
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